> you wouldn't see much of a need for those do-it-yourself types to accumulate wealth just for the sake of doing so.

Exactly this.

Money is a way to get other people to do things for you.

If you are happier doing the things yourself, the money doesn't have much use.

At a certain point, gaining more wealth just doesn't matter.

Yeah I noticed this. There are lots of kids or people who feel redundant and empty because whatever they want to do they can just buy it or hire someone else to do it for them. No need to do anything yourself but it also means nobody needs you which means people don't see anything in you other than your money.

The only way you can liberate yourself from this is by getting your hands dirty yourself.

Or by taking pride in the work you do to earn the money.

I really don't think one precludes the other.

You can take pride in the work you get paid for and the work you do outside of work just the same.

Some things have economies of scale. I could in theory dig minerals out of the ground, refine and distill them, and do the chemistry required to turn them into antibiotics... but that'd be about a million times more expensive (in bootstrapping monetary cost and labor) than just getting together with a bunch of people to found an oil refinery and a drug factory.

If only we didn't live in a world of property taxes...

Wealth should not be sneered at. Wealth buys a new well for your farm. Wealth buys you tools to expand your capabilities. Wealth allows you to exploit the capabilities of society to accomplish things beyond yourself. Do you want to preserve gun or property rights so you can continue to live a self-reliant lifestyle? That takes wealth(or you can cop-out and let other people do it for you).

I am well aware of the saying "sell your time to buy the time that other people sold", but that cynically omits the benefits of comparative advantage. Most HN readers time is far more valuable than a plumber or carpenter.

> Most HN readers time is far more valuable than a plumber or carpenter.

Are you sure about that? A good plumber, here in Seattle, can cost $300/hour.

Depends on how many hours you can work, though, and how many hours you're not getting paid for.

That's extremely rare in Seattle, maybe for overnight emergency, and that "hour" includes drive/admin time and overhead costs.

I think part of the problem is we’ve confused (and society has disproportionately valued) what is valuable to the economy vs what is valuable to society.

I think it was Penn Jillette who basically said we should most value those who we’d want around in the apocalypse. Farmers, doctors, mechanics would all be worth more than a financier. Maybe the irony is that in the coming decades they will have their comeuppance if their jobs are least likely to be automated away

David Graeber (RIP) and others would seriously question whether the financier even does anything for the economy, let alone society.

A financier works to efficiently allocate resources in the economy, which is very valuable.

Right, valuable to the economy. But my original point is that “what is valuable to the economy” and “what is valuable to society” may be divergent

I think the argument is they provide liquidity to an economy, but I’m not sure how that it translated to a value assessment

On one end of the spectrum, they make capital available to businesses in order for them to bootstrap and expand. They pick winners and losers and make decisions that significantly alter the course of economic development.

On the other end of the spectrum, they gamble on tulips. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulip_mania

There's everything in-between. Factor in the universal human tendency for self-delusion, and you got tulip pushers who think they are moving the pillars of world.

The counter argument (Mariana Mazzucato in particular) is that they extract value rather than create value, and this, like all other value extraction, is a net harm.

If you want to apply a respect/disrespect lens, "I could do that" is the disrespectful position.

The respectful position is "this isn't my speciality, it's yours, tell me what you need and I'll get out of the way."

"The time it would take me to acquire your skills is more valuable than what you'd charge to fix my problem" is acknowledging the plumber's value, not diminishing it.

Is it your position that plumbers charge low rates just to be nice

You seem to be protecting a lot into a simple price comparison.

You're not being snarky. Seems pretty on the mark.