How two British orthodontists became celebrities to incels

Re:How two British orthodontists became celebrities to incels by claudiawerner on Saturday August 22, 2020 @04:53PM (#24247182)

I'm partially with you. The article goes on to say:

>Like the movements against vaccines or circumcision or GMOs, orthotropics spoke to its newfound adherents’ reactionary desires, affirming their skepticism of authority and faceless establishments; promising to restore a stolen masculinity; and recounting a simple but exhilarating narrative that pitted modernity against the best interests of the human race.

Does it make any sense for opposition to circumcision at birth in the absence of complications to be compared to anti-vaccination and anti-GMOs? It seems as though the sentence is written to say that all of these are 'promising to restore a stolen masculinity', but I can't see how anti-GMO ideology works in that framework, and I'm not entirely convinced the anti-circumcision argument is all about that.

"Incel" is probably a debatable term that's thrown around a lot; while there is undeniably a community of misogynistic men who blame their misfortune in the dating world on modern society and its women, there are also those who are simply involuntarily celibate - no further qualification needed. Perhaps they accept that the problem is themselves, or they think it lies elsewhere - but neither of those necessitate the description of all 'involuntarily celibate' people as misogynists who are mad about 'Stacy' and 'Chad'. Worse still, to say you want to be in a relationship but are not, or you'd like to have sex but can't, thanks to the toxic online 'incel' community, certain connotations will be attached - whether you're an a male ('incel') or female (the less commonly used term, 'femcel').

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Re:How two British orthodontists became celebrities to incels by api on Saturday August 22, 2020 @05:04PM (#24247248)

Anyone grouping anti-circumision alongside anti-GMO and anti-vax is almost certainly American. Circumcision is far less common even in Canada and is rare outside Orthodox Jews in some European countries. The association of circumcision with modernity is also weird given that it's an incredibly ancient practice that has been questioned much more in modern times.

America has this peculiar custom of always circumcising by default regardless of religion, though it's been fading a bit over time. My kids were both girls but we did talk about it and the hospital told us we would have to elect to circumcise rather than electing not to. That's apparently a change.

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Re:How two British orthodontists became celebrities to incels by claudiawerner on Saturday August 22, 2020 @05:21PM (#24247345)

Circumcision at birth in the absence of any problems has never made sense to me; it's not common in the country where I live, and it's a little scary that it's almost common practice in the US. From the downvotes I'm getting on my parent comment, I'm guessing people may think I'm pro-circumcision, but I think it's being anti-GMO and anti-vaxx that's unreasonable from my point of view. I can't think of any good reason to circumcise boys in the absence of medical problems - other than the slightly reduced risk of penile cancer, but that's a very rare form of cancer, and even so, we don't remove tonsils from healthy children, nor do we amputate their limbs to reduce the risk of canacer.

If someone (especially the downvoters) could explain what the advantage of circumcision is, I'd be at least interested to hear it.

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Re:How two British orthodontists became celebrities to incels by paulryanrogers on Saturday August 22, 2020 @06:22PM (#24247741)

Here in the US they claim it makes infection less likely. Supposedly uncircumcised men must carefully clean to avoid that. Haven't seen any compelling research to the supposed benefits. And there is a very real risk of mutilation or infection with any surgery.

More likely the Judeo-Christian influence lead some to justify the practice when it come under scrutiny.

EDIT: research not reach

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Re:How two British orthodontists became celebrities to incels by golemiprague on Saturday August 22, 2020 @06:18PM (#24247716)

For Jews at least it is not about health or any other advantages, it is just a religious command which suppose to be a covenant between a Jew and its maker, a bit like when people used to cut their finger and mix the blood to symbolise a covenant between people.

Ironically, unlike other religion laws which non practicing Jews are not following, circumcision is almost universally practiced. I think the reason is that it is a bit of an identity thing, like Maori tattoos or something like that.

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Re:How two British orthodontists became celebrities to incels by zhte415 on Sunday August 23, 2020 @03:52AM (#24250342)

Circumsision is genital mutation accepted to a child on birth or childhood. Disgusting. Yet accepted in the US. Bizarre.

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