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Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by jedberg on Friday August 14, 2020 @03:08PM (#24161986)
I think they serve different purposes. Satellites serve areas where they can't run wires or it's insanely expensive for too few people. Think very rural areas and war torn areas. Imagine being able to get unblocked internet in China by using satellites? Or in Belarus. Or the middle of Amazon (rainforest)?
Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by gamblor956 on Friday August 14, 2020 @03:18PM (#24162110)
People keep bringing that up as a common use case, but how do you propose that people in China or wartorn countries will get their hands on the modems they would need to use Starlink?
Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by Alupis on Friday August 14, 2020 @03:22PM (#24162151)
Or even afford it?

People earning an equivalent of a couple USD a day, or nothing at all, aren't going to be able to afford to pay some US corporation for fast internet.

Fast internet probably isn't even a concern in wartorn countries, honestly.

Let's be honest - Starlink is almost exclusively going to be used by people living in rural areas within developed nations.

Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by DudeInBasement on Friday August 14, 2020 @03:48PM (#24162422)
Implying the US government won't pay for the cost of an open internet where people can search for 'bad people square'
Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by Alupis on Friday August 14, 2020 @03:52PM (#24162468)
I'm not sure I understand your comment.

Why would the US Government (aka. Taxpayers) pay for internet use in other nations?

We already have expensive problems domestically that people would rather spend that coin on.

Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by bronco21016 on Friday August 14, 2020 @04:15PM (#24162714)
Winning 'hearts and minds'.

You drop access to the internet as whole in places where the internet is suppressed or non-existent and the populace learns just how bad they have things then they might revolt on their own.

I wouldn't say I 100% advocate for the idea but thats the thought process behind it.

Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by gamblor956 on Friday August 14, 2020 @04:51PM (#24163105)
That would generally be considered a violation of another country's airspace, and some countries would even treat that as an act of war.

You would also have to deal with the real possibility that those countries would simply shoot down any planes observed dropping Starlink base stations.

Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by mensetmanusman on Friday August 14, 2020 @08:21PM (#24164783)
nonprofits air drop usbs full of news in north korea, violations happen all the time
Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by jedberg on Friday August 14, 2020 @03:22PM (#24162157)
US government airdrops?
Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by RandomBacon on Friday August 14, 2020 @03:51PM (#24162464)
There are a bunch or articles that talk about people using balloons to send material to North Korea.

The Human Rights Foundation even collects flash drives to load them up with content to smuggle into North Korea: https://flashdrivesforfreedom.org

Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by Alupis on Friday August 14, 2020 @03:55PM (#24162497)
For private groups, or individuals, sure you can get away with this.

For a government to do this? How could that not lead to an armed conflict?

Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by bawolff on Friday August 14, 2020 @11:58PM (#24165801)
Because if the government is the USA, who is really going to go to war with them over this?

You're not wrong, information/propaganda warfare is aggressive. Sometimes it makes more strategic sense then open warfare, and sometimes states can get away with it when they can't get away with open warfare.

Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by freehunter on Friday August 14, 2020 @04:31PM (#24162886)
How do governments airdrop supplies into war-torn countries today? I’ll admit I’m no expert but I see headlines all the time of neutral nations sending supplies to other countries who are fighting a war and that neutral nation isn’t getting dragged into the fight.
Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by gamblor956 on Friday August 14, 2020 @04:59PM (#24163208)
Governments don't airdrop supplies into war-torn countries today, excepting designated UN or MSF refugee camps, and they do so with the knowledge of one or both sides of the conflict so that the supply planes don't get shot down.

I would very much like to see a headline of a neutral nation airdropping supplies into a country engaged in war without getting dragged into the conflict. I'm not aware of that having occurred in the past 4 decades.

Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by gamblor956 on Friday August 14, 2020 @04:55PM (#24163155)
Do people not understand that satellite internet already exists today?

We don't drop satellite modems into war torn countries now, and we're not going to start doing that just because Elon Musk needs to check off one of his PR claims.

Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by jedberg on Friday August 14, 2020 @05:00PM (#24163220)
They're really expensive and big. Also, we actually do sometimes drop satellite internet into places.
Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by gamblor956 on Friday August 14, 2020 @06:11PM (#24163928)
Unless the pictures on Google are wrong, a Starlink base station is significantly larger than a satellite phone and is at least as large as a field base station.

And at $2000/pop, they're at least as expensive as the equipment we're currently not randomly dropping around the globe because of the expense.

Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by closeparen on Friday August 14, 2020 @03:49PM (#24162442)
Possession of unauthorized satellite equipment is as good as getting caught red-handed at a dead drop. A paranoid security state wouldn't blink at executing every such person as a spy.
Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by Alupis on Friday August 14, 2020 @03:15PM (#24162073)
Will Starlink even be able to legally sell internet services in China? Would they not have to comply with CCP's censorship policies and disconnect people at their will?

I strongly disagree with CCP's policies here, but that's not for us to decide.

Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by jedberg on Friday August 14, 2020 @03:24PM (#24162180)
I was thinking of the opposite use case -- an American traveling to China for work and getting uncensored internet.

But I mean once a Chinese citizen gets their hands on the equipment, I'm not sure how China would stop them. I suppose they could have roving bands of listening posts looking for the uplink signals.

I'm sure someone could figure out a way to take payments for them. Many rich Chinese citizens already have bank accounts outside of China.

Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by Alupis on Friday August 14, 2020 @03:30PM (#24162243)
Pretty sure an American company deliberately subverting another nation's laws to make a profit isn't going to be looked well upon, even if it is unjust CCP laws.

Regarding an American traveling to China - I think you're still beholden to the host country's laws, no? You can't break their local laws just because you're from out of town.

Not to mention the punitive actions CCP could take against Tesla (as they try to build out a business there) to put pressure on SpaceX to stop allowing Starlink access in China. That wouldn't be fair either, but Musk is CEO of both organizations and I'm not sure the CCP would distinguish them separately.

Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by bdamm on Friday August 14, 2020 @03:36PM (#24162324)
SpaceX isn't going to piss off China. The satellites are really just repeaters to the local base station. Starlink will be firewalled off from the world just like the rest of China (when the terminal is in China.)
Re:Beta users of Starlink get downloads of 11 to 60 Mbps by Klathmon on Friday August 14, 2020 @03:42PM (#24162366)
>I suppose they could have roving bands of listening posts looking for the uplink signals.

I think this is pretty likely.

In the US the FCC has a whole set of systems designed to locate interference sources [1], and I've heard stories that they're extremely good at it. They even have a whole facility in Maryland dedicated to satellite monitoring!

[1] https://www.fcc.gov/over-air-spectrum-observation-capabiliti...