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Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by grasshopperpurp on Monday July 27, 2020 @07:19AM (#23963994)
Except for bailouts - like the one currently being proposed - USPS is self-funded and does not receive money from taxes. One problem is that USPS is meant to be a service (congress has to approve rate increases), but it's treated like a business. This wouldn't be such an issue if people weren't trying to sabotage it so that they could privatize it.

I've heard the deal with Amazon is bad, and the new Postmaster General is trying to renegotiate it.

In my experience, no Priority or First Class packages were delayed in favor of Amazon packages, but the flood of Amazon packages did overburden the system causing some delays. From what I understand, USPS is receiving more Amazon, because more people are shopping online (Covid) and because Amazon is (was?) dealing with a labor dispute. A couple weeks back my station got absolutely hammered - received about triple the typical Amazon volume on back-to-back days. The clerks have to sort each package to the appropriate routes, and then the carriers have to deliver all those packages. As they're out delivering, they're picking up packages to bring back to the station, and those are the packages that were subject to delays.

In general, everything goes out every day, and even if one package is left behind, someone has to drive that package to the plant. From a business standpoint, this doesn't make a lot of sense, but it's part of the service culture at USPS, and clerks and carriers are horrified and mortified to hold up mail, which is why you see complaints like the one from the carrier in the article.

At the same time, USPS was rolling out some new policies, and they're missing a lot of people due to Covid, so a lot of factors converged to make the situation difficult. But, at my station, no mail has been delayed for weeks. I can't speak for the plants, but the vast majority of Amazon packages are delivered to the stations as drop shipments, so if the plants are having issues with volume, it's not because of Amazon.

During Covid, letters and flats had been down in volume (businesses being closed = less advertising) by somewhere between 25% and 40%, but they appear to be back to normal, and parcels had been up something like 60% overall.

I think that's most of the pertinent information. But, I'll say that this is typically the time of year where many USPS employees exhale a bit. The overtime dwindles, and the pace slows. Instead, much of this has felt like Christmas - anyone on the OT list and any non-career employees are working lots of hours to keep up with demand, and sometimes they're even compelling people not on the OT list to work OT. So, it feels like the holiday season never stopped, and we're all pretty exhausted. Of course, we feel lucky to have been able to work through the pandemic, but it's taken its toll, as well.

Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by hahamrfunnyguy on Monday July 27, 2020 @08:05AM (#23964279)
I run a mail order business. I haven't noticed any delays.
Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by VLM on Monday July 27, 2020 @08:25AM (#23964408)
Its important to note that the purpose of the article is to take an isolated incident of one strangely misguided manager and/or management labor dispute turning into false accusations, and turn that isolated incident into a stage for national policy discussion. By doing that the source becomes a propaganda outlet instead of a journalist outlet, unfortunately.

Possibly, if you shipped a product thru that one individual post office, it might have arrived a day late. Not surprising you haven't noticed the problem, because there isn't one.

Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by jeromegv on Monday July 27, 2020 @09:23AM (#23964814)
The stop of overtime at USPS, in the middle of a surge in online shopping, is real. The lack of staff right now due to COVID but also due to lack of hiring, is real. Every other carriers is hiring like crazy, but not USPS. The problem is real. The fact that the OP anecdata did not experience any delays is totally irrelevant to the conversation.
Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by nomel on Monday July 27, 2020 @04:09PM (#23968900)
Is there any inherent problem with the USPS over-hiring now and needing to let people go later? Is it somehow not possible for them to easily reduce the workforce after this, temporary, surge?
Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by Phrenzy on Monday July 27, 2020 @08:33AM (#23964464)
I've noticed delays in getting items shipped to me via USPS. One shipment took several months. Just because you do not perceive an issue does not mean one does not exist.
Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by tux1968 on Monday July 27, 2020 @09:39AM (#23964948)
Having something take several months is not what is being discussed though. That is not an example of slow shipping, that is an example of something being lost or misdirected.
Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by jellicle on Monday July 27, 2020 @09:02AM (#23964654)
While the article is simply a local report about a local issue, it got reported because the USPS is intentionally slowing down mail delivery nationally, under a new boss who was appointed to wreck the agency:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business/2020/07/14/postal-se...

Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by stickfigure on Monday July 27, 2020 @10:53AM (#23965625)
I also run a mail order business with "statistically significant" order quantity sent USPS. I've been tracking delivery times. For several weeks around July 4 more than 10% of packages were seeing >2 week delivery times. However it has since returned to normal.

I expect delivery times will go sideways again in Q4.

Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by morpheuskafka on Monday July 27, 2020 @08:47AM (#23964548)
> meant to be a service (congress has to approve rate increases), but it's treated like a business.

This is exactly the way a utility works.

Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by hannasanarion on Monday July 27, 2020 @11:06AM (#23965792)
The difference is that utilities don't also have their liabilities defined in law. No electric company has a standing mandate to stuff $110 billion under a mattress so that they can pay pensions to people who won't be born until the next century.
Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by casefields on Monday July 27, 2020 @05:19PM (#23969509)
If they did PG&E couldn't just run to bankruptcy court and get away with all the fire and destruction they caused.

Maybe we should make more utilities be prepared like the USPS.

Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by onetimemanytime on Monday July 27, 2020 @07:51AM (#23964186)
USA should eat the loss, or let USPS run itself as a business (no deliveries for 55 cents to Alaska for one). Of course they can't since entire USA runs on it: bills, tax notices, communications, e-commerce etc etc. So what it loses $10 Billion a year? Call it a loss leader.
Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by JshWright on Monday July 27, 2020 @08:09AM (#23964296)
Or let it provide banking services... It would add another revenue stream and provide a service that is currently very hard to access in many areas.
Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by lifeisstillgood on Monday July 27, 2020 @08:17AM (#23964355)
Banking services for rural Alaskans / people without internet access / anyone else in the 2% [x] lose about as much as postal services.

[x] In the west big tech can more or less serve 98% of the population. but there is (approx) 2% of the population who for various reasons are massively uneconomic to serve - mentally, ill, disabled, poor, lacking literacy skills or the wrong language. Hell its probably more than 2%. But the point is Government must serve these people and provide a level playing field. Commercial companies dont have to.

Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by JshWright on Monday July 27, 2020 @10:50AM (#23965586)
Those are already challenges the USPS has to deal with. They have infrastructure in place to address those challenges. If they're paying those costs anyway, they might as well add services that can take advantage of that investment in exchange for more revenue.

There certainly would be an additional marginal cost, but it would be much, much less than an entity trying to start that from zero.

Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by delfinom on Monday July 27, 2020 @12:13PM (#23966482)
I believe something like 10% of NYC is unbanked.
Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by mullen on Monday July 27, 2020 @12:56PM (#23966920)
Of hand, I believe it is a lot higher than that. I listen to an NPR (Or was it NYTimes?) podcast that interviewed working poor people and the number thrown around was that something like 40% of Americans working poor are unbanked with some areas of the country upwards of 60% (I think they said certain zip codes in Queens) are unbanked. What really stings working poor people from using banks are the hidden fees. There needs to be cheap and no frills banking for the poor.
Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by NovemberWhiskey on Monday July 27, 2020 @06:10PM (#23970017)
Banks are required to offer such accounts by law in NY:

https://www.dfs.ny.gov/consumers/banking_money/basic_bank_ac...

Do you mean even cheaper and less frills than that?

Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by missedthecue on Monday July 27, 2020 @03:26PM (#23968495)
It's not for lack of banking locations.
Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by millzlane on Monday July 27, 2020 @08:19AM (#23964371)
Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by SilasX on Monday July 27, 2020 @11:30AM (#23966032)
So it would make a profit providing a service no one else finds profitable (offering services to these unbanked), and will also take a loss to serve this underserved marked?

How can it act as both a public service and source of free money? Even if it made a small profit doing so, it would be less than ramping up their most profitable areas and would have an opportunity cost.

(If you mean they should do it purely as a public service, that's a fair point, but you're writing like it's an easy way to improve their financial position, which doesn't make sense.)

Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by JshWright on Monday July 27, 2020 @03:27PM (#23968508)
I don't think it's a given that just because no one else finds it profitable means that the USPS couldn't operate it in a profitable way.

Most of the reasons that it isn't profitable relate to problems that the USPS already has to solve as part of their core function. It doesn't make sense for a bank to invest in physical infrastructure in the middle of nowhere, the cost of the building would erase any potential profit. The post office already has a building there though (and staff, etc). A significant amount of the up front expense, as well as a decent chunk of the ongoing expenses, is already going to be spent anyway.

Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by SilasX on Monday July 27, 2020 @04:53PM (#23969254)
Yes, but that means you're saying the USPS has some kind of advantage locating where there are disproportionate unbanked and also a dearth of banks. But I keep hearing about the unbanked as being an issue of large urban areas, which don't have any shortage of bank locations.

So for these five or six people in rural areas that can't get a bank account, and aren't complete deadbeats, and can't get to a bank as easily as they can get to a post office, the USPS has a cost advantage in serving them. Okay. I just don't see numbers that make this a big source of free money.

Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by VLM on Monday July 27, 2020 @08:26AM (#23964414)
The USPS should provide local health care services. An interesting deployment strategy for socialized medicine. It would be everything everyone expects from both right and left wing perspectives.

Edited to add: Wealthy privileged HN readers would not know this, but poor people who are "unbanked" have to use USPS money orders to pay bills, and the USPS charges a fraction of one percent on money orders. So yes, the USPS is already performing banking functions.

[dead]
Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by mrguyorama on Monday July 27, 2020 @11:20AM (#23965936)
The implications in your comment are gross, but to respond to the underlying question:

Using a bank as a poor person is stupid expensive. Have less than 200$ in an account? That's a monthly fee. Use your debit card less than 15 times last month? That's a fee. Need checks for that account with only $100 in it? Most people get them for free but you pay. For a time, TD Bank was even applying transactions to your account out of order so you would incur more than expected overdrafts and accrue more overdraft fees than you actually should have had. They lost a court case about that and had to pay people a few dollars, because class action suits are a travesty of justice often.

Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by delfinom on Monday July 27, 2020 @12:15PM (#23966496)
>Just curious, but why are poor people unbanked? It seems like one could open a bank account with pretty much $5 at almost any bank in the country.

With a $15/month charge for having less than $1000 in the account per month.

With a destroyed credit history when Wells Fargo and BoA continue their stock value pumping shenanigans and opening accounts in your name.

Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by akuchling on Monday July 27, 2020 @11:41AM (#23966146)
For another discussion of why banks are terrible for poor people: "Why It's More Expensive to Be Poor", from PBS's personal-finance channel: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLwRZibUqL0
Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by cameronbrown on Monday July 27, 2020 @09:17AM (#23964754)
Loss leader is fine, but they still need to retain accountability.
Re:Amazon gets priority while mail gets delayed, say US lett... by munk-a on Monday July 27, 2020 @12:46PM (#23966832)
You can't really evaluate a public service's accountability based on its balance sheet alone. It's a public service and is there to... provide a service.

In the past USPS has been evaluated as "thing that should make money" which is silly - if it was profitable to run a reliable service in that space the commercial sector would have forced out the government.