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Re:Teaching isn’t about managing behavior by nickff on Saturday July 25, 2020 @04:13PM (#23952045)
The problem with applying your priorities (for the idealists) is that the misbehaving kids tend to come from the 'victimized' groups. This means that by enforcing clasroom discipline, they (often) feel that they are reinforcing the patriarchy, white supremacy, or other evil side.
Re:Teaching isn’t about managing behavior by catalogia on Saturday July 25, 2020 @04:39PM (#23952207)
Suppose a child disrupts class for 30 of his peers because his dad beats him. His dad has now effectively victimized 31 kids.

Wouldn't it be productive and moral to find ways to help all 31, perhaps by putting misbehaving kids in special classrooms where they can receive specialized help?

Re:Teaching isn’t about managing behavior by lifeisstillgood on Sunday July 26, 2020 @04:40AM (#23955488)
This is still behaviour management, but not entirely in the schools circle. Society as a whole needs to help manage the behaviour - we manage the dads behaviour by arresting him, manage the rest of the family through in person support and finally worry about the school.
Re:Teaching isn’t about managing behavior by jessaustin on Saturday July 25, 2020 @09:34PM (#23953721)
First let's hire another teacher and cut that class size down!
Re:Teaching isn’t about managing behavior by chongli on Saturday July 25, 2020 @08:39PM (#23953490)
It would take one hell of a teacher to handle a full class of misbehaving students. I think most teachers would pass on that opportunity.
Re:Teaching isn’t about managing behavior by danielheath on Saturday July 25, 2020 @08:35PM (#23953474)
Assuming the specialised help isn’t just worse facilities somewhere else, maybe (or maybe not). In practice - who is going to ensure the other facilities are of a good standard? The abusive parents?

If you don’t help that kid, the other 30 will spend their whole lives sharing a society with an adult who didn’t get help. That’s an unfair drain on their life too (increased crime, policing costs, etc).

Putting the disruptive kids in the same place as everyone else means the incentives are right to do something useful to help them.

Re:Teaching isn’t about managing behavior by catalogia on Sunday July 26, 2020 @12:19AM (#23954406)
One of my aunts is a such a specialized teacher; her program is called "emotional support" or something to that effect. From what I understand it's a classroom in the same school building and the students sent to her classroom are troubled in frequently very sad ways which she won't discuss in specifics. She's accountable to the same principle that the normal teachers are.

From what I know of this sort of program, it seems to be a sincere attempt to help kids, not merely brush them off into a corner to forget about them. I don't know how often it's successful, but I think in that school district at least it's well motivated. From what I know of it, it seems like a much better system than allowing those kids to disrupt normal classrooms.

Re:Teaching isn’t about managing behavior by ed25519FUUU on Sunday July 26, 2020 @10:58AM (#23957509)
That’s good work your aunt is doing. Necessary work indeed, but unfortunately not academic work.

For these students who are deeply troubled, there must be healing before there can really be learning.

Re:Teaching isn’t about managing behavior by dataduck on Sunday July 26, 2020 @05:26AM (#23955680)
That's because it's the same thing. Creating the level of order necessary for learning (or any other civilized behaviour) is the entirety of what "Patriarchy" really means. White supremacy recently got redefined to include things like punctuality and objectivity, which is even more on the nose.
Re:Teaching isn’t about managing behavior by jkoudys on Sunday July 26, 2020 @08:07AM (#23956483)
I won't dispute that "patriarchy" (or even white supremecy) are forms of order, but they're order built by forcing roles on people based on gender and race. Anyone wrapping punctuality up into that is enforcing such a system by assigning someone's station based on race, not fighting against it.
Re:Teaching isn’t about managing behavior by giantg2 on Sunday July 26, 2020 @09:40AM (#23956979)
Is this sarcasm? Being punctual or object is now racist?
Re:Teaching isn’t about managing behavior by hevelvarik on Sunday July 26, 2020 @10:48AM (#23957432)
Re:Teaching isn’t about managing behavior by giantg2 on Sunday July 26, 2020 @11:39AM (#23957850)
Wow how racist is that.