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Re:Tesla may call warranty repairs goodwill due to lemon lau... by josefx on Sunday July 12, 2020 @04:10PM (#23814361)
A "goodwill repair" is a repair where Tesla asserts that it is an issue caused by the user and not a warranty case. That Tesla is covering the costs of fixing it is merely a matter of goodwill instead.

The article alleges that Tesla wrongly handles most warranty cases as goodwill repairs. This hits a lot of possible legal issues.

* They can avoid legislation dealing with chronic defects in cars.

* They can sidestep reporting requirements for road safety issues.

* They can fudge the books when they report repair costs.

* They can avoid labeling cars they had to buy back appropriately.

Re:Tesla may call warranty repairs goodwill due to lemon lau... by jbob2000 on Sunday July 12, 2020 @11:31PM (#23816889)
I think the intent behind the goodwill repair is important. If Tesla is doing this intentionally as a legal loophole, then there’s a problem.

But electric cars are new, we’re still understanding some of the problems with them, and we’re still understanding how people are using them. It’s not unreasonable for Tesla to have a high rate for these repairs given how unique their product is.

Re:Tesla may call warranty repairs goodwill due to lemon lau... by hellisothers on Sunday July 12, 2020 @11:38PM (#23816935)
The first sentence makes to a of sense but the second one seems unrelated to any of the discussion.

Let’s say the rate is high because of how unique their product is, how does that change anything? The repairs should still be recorded correctly (not goodwill) and laws followed accordingly?

Re:Tesla may call warranty repairs goodwill due to lemon lau... by jbob2000 on Monday July 13, 2020 @08:18AM (#23819924)
The lemon laws were written for the combustion engine days, where hundreds of mechanical components can reasonably add up to an unfixable lemon.

A defunct battery can be swapped. A bad electric motor can be swapped. Sensors can be changed. These are trivial to do on an electric car.

There’s an incredible labour cost to do this kind of swapping on a combusting engine. An engine swap? That takes a highly experienced mechanic for an ICU. Transmission issues are also write offs.

The bar for an electric lemon is much higher.

Re:Tesla may call warranty repairs goodwill due to lemon lau... by ballenf on Monday July 13, 2020 @11:35AM (#23821861)
I really don't understand the logic here. If EVs are so easily repaired, wouldn't that mean that no EV customer or maker would ever be concerned with the concept of a lemon car? No manufacturer would need to do any dancing around the law -- no NDAs, no "goodwill" repairs of warrantied defects, etc.

Personally, I think lemon laws are overall very good for car manufacturers: they give people a sense of comfort regarding the worst-case scenario in purchasing a new car. And that's especially important for cars based on new technologies. But I'd love to see whether there's any empirical support for this.

Re:Tesla may call warranty repairs goodwill due to lemon lau... by hellisothers on Monday July 13, 2020 @11:47AM (#23822016)
Agreed, and it may be that swapping out a battery or engine is easy but I don’t want my brand new car in the shop 3-4x a year because my car just stopped working at the grocery store. Especially when wait times for servicing can be protracted. It doesn’t matter if the car runs on hopes and dreams, it needs to be reliable.
Re:Tesla may call warranty repairs goodwill due to lemon lau... by breakingcups on Monday July 13, 2020 @05:34AM (#23818881)
The article points out that Tesla seems to only perform these goodwill repairs when the car is still under warranty, but I have no idea how well-sourced that is.