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Re:The Selfie and the Self: In Defence of Duckface (2019) by hippich on Friday July 10, 2020 @09:24AM (#23791213)
We should not shame people - that should be enough on its own IMHO :)
Re:The Selfie and the Self: In Defence of Duckface (2019) by asa4akj on Friday July 10, 2020 @10:10AM (#23791612)
Completely disagree. Shame is a very potent society shaping factor. Without it humans wouldn't be as civilized.

So we should just use shame appropriately.

Re:The Selfie and the Self: In Defence of Duckface (2019) by hippich on Friday July 10, 2020 @11:06AM (#23792205)
Intuitively, I agree with potential shaping factor. But shaming making people civilized - that certainly deserves a citation.

But that's all besides the point. Judging by myself only of course, I seriously doubt people shame others because of the duty to higher purpose (making people civilized).

Re:The Selfie and the Self: In Defence of Duckface (2019) by vageli on Friday July 10, 2020 @11:49AM (#23792756)
Shame is a way to impose social norms without violence. To me it is intuitive that shame is a fundamental tool used to organize groups, especially when thinking about the formation of more primitive societies. Not intended to replace a citation, just my two cents.
Re:The Selfie and the Self: In Defence of Duckface (2019) by soared on Friday July 10, 2020 @12:09PM (#23792969)
A sportscaster recently talked about how great public shaming is. Athletes who make dumb tweets learn better if they’re publicly shamed rather than when they are suspended from playing.

That makes sense to me - do something dumb socially, the repercussions should be social as well.

Re:The Selfie and the Self: In Defence of Duckface (2019) by nitrogen on Friday July 10, 2020 @12:26PM (#23793162)
This is definitely a position that is easier to hold in a position of privilege/popularity.

Shaming has rather drastic negative consequences, especially in communities that shame intelligence, education, gender, race, neurotype, etc.

Re:The Selfie and the Self: In Defence of Duckface (2019) by pc86 on Friday July 10, 2020 @12:43PM (#23793375)
I don't think anyone here implied shaming doesn't have [potentially negative] consequences.

It's a non-violent tool to shape societal or group norms. If you are in a shitty group (e.g. one that shames education), that doesn't change the argument.

Re:The Selfie and the Self: In Defence of Duckface (2019) by nitrogen on Saturday July 11, 2020 @12:50PM (#23803507)
Rule #1 with any weapon is to ask what it looks like when the tables are turned and someone uses it against you.
Re:The Selfie and the Self: In Defence of Duckface (2019) by asa4akj on Wednesday July 15, 2020 @09:15AM (#23844712)
Every weapon is bad in the arms of the enemy. I won't be cutting any hands because they can form fists.
Re:The Selfie and the Self: In Defence of Duckface (2019) by harryf on Friday July 10, 2020 @10:01AM (#23791524)
Is that truly an absolute?

“You we’re texting and driving. You could have killed someone!”

And if you genuinely believe people posting selfies are narcissists, does this mean you should ignore and keep quiet?

Re:The Selfie and the Self: In Defence of Duckface (2019) by ghostpepper on Friday July 10, 2020 @11:20AM (#23792388)
Are we talking about whether it's morally defensible to shame someone for doing something irresponsible (like texting and driving) or whether it's actually likely to change their behavior (ie. whether it's good for society).

The latter does not seem to clear cut; there are likely better, more positive ways to change behavior. Shame is more likely to make the person get better at hiding their irresponsible behavior, which is actually counterproductive for society.

I'm still not convinced that shame is ever a useful tool.

Re:The Selfie and the Self: In Defence of Duckface (2019) by hippich on Friday July 10, 2020 @10:49AM (#23791998)
I can see why would you care about texting and driving (and why there are laws against it). Why would you care about selfies?