Re:U.S. Supreme Court deems half of Oklahoma a Native Americ...
by Mangalor on Thursday July 09, 2020 @01:45PM
(#23782871)
I mean if we're getting into it, "white man" basically genocided their whole population with disease. The Native Americans never did anything nearly so heinous.
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Re:U.S. Supreme Court deems half of Oklahoma a Native Americ...
by dudul on Thursday July 09, 2020 @02:12PM
(#23783209)
I'm not sure I understand your comment. If the genocide happened due to diseases imported from the Old World, how is it "heinous"? It happened at a time where people had no clue what diseases and immune systems were.
Re:U.S. Supreme Court deems half of Oklahoma a Native Americ...
by sulam on Thursday July 09, 2020 @02:44PM
(#23783577)
I dispute your characterization that people had no clue.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Fort_Pitt#Biological_...
Re:U.S. Supreme Court deems half of Oklahoma a Native Americ...
by dudul on Thursday July 09, 2020 @03:02PM
(#23783768)
But that happened in the 18th century though, by then of course, empirical observation had played its role and a few people tried to weaponize it. I'm pretty sure accidental contamination during the 2 preceding centuries had already caused a massive decline in population.
Re:U.S. Supreme Court deems half of Oklahoma a Native Americ...
by Mangalor on Thursday July 09, 2020 @02:25PM
(#23783376)
Whether or not they knew they were transporting disease at the time really doesn't excuse the end result: mass genocide. And of course this doesn't authorize taking land.
Re:U.S. Supreme Court deems half of Oklahoma a Native Americ...
by dudul on Thursday July 09, 2020 @02:35PM
(#23783472)
It totally excuses it. Intent is key. If you have no clue what a disease, a virus, an immune system are I don't see how you can be called "heinous" for unknowingly and unwillingly spread diseases.
As for lands, I don't know, lands all over the world have been changing hands since human beings learnt how to walk, most of the time after violence/war. It happened in 1500 when the concept of "nation" didn't even exist and the only way to say that a land was yours was to be able to keep it.
Re:U.S. Supreme Court deems half of Oklahoma a Native Americ...
by ceejayoz on Thursday July 09, 2020 @02:38PM
(#23783504)
The genocide of Native Americans extends far beyond the introduction of diseases like smallpox, in much more intentional ways.
Re:U.S. Supreme Court deems half of Oklahoma a Native Americ...
by dudul on Thursday July 09, 2020 @03:04PM
(#23783796)
Oh I agree. I was originally puzzled by the mention of "death by disease" as a "heinous" thing. I didn't dispute that heinous things were done.
Re:U.S. Supreme Court deems half of Oklahoma a Native Americ...
by umvi on Thursday July 09, 2020 @02:53PM
(#23783692)
Well, then China is responsible for mass genocide due to Covid-19 then. After all, whether or not they knew they were transporting disease to other countries 6 months back really doesn't excuse the end result.
Re:U.S. Supreme Court deems half of Oklahoma a Native Americ...
by robertlagrant on Thursday July 09, 2020 @02:45PM
(#23783584)
I don't think accidental genocide is a thing.