Exactly.

> JIO is deeply embedded into the rural populace. Exactly the ones who are vulnerable to disinformation campaigns.

This deeply concerns me as it will have unwanted consequences.

I'm sure WhatsApp is already more deeply entrenched than Jio.

This is more of a commerce play, nothing to do with disinformation dissemination.

Democracy is not about running private companies. CCI and monopoly laws should take care of that.

Does India have less free speech protections?

Imagine a rumor going around in Whatsapp.

Lets say it violates free speech laws and is liable to be sued and the one who sues is sure to win.

Lets say he sues and wins.

It still doesn't matter. Rumor about the lawsuit and the falsehood of the original content is already old news. And is not as quickly spreading as the original rumor.

The perpetrators of the original rumor win the war to influence, in-spite of free speech protections.

Free speech protections and laws mean nothing and are toothless in face of modern mass media tech.

Compare it to the old days, of the news being said on TV or Radio or in a Newspaper. They too can spread wild rumors but have definite and impactful backlash.

That negative feedback mechanism is lacking in platforms like FB and Whatsapp.

Probably but are laws real without enforcement?

I have seen few people getting beaten up badly and two dying due to mob killing them with law enforcement involved for speaking against "religious stuff" and a politician.

Just a recent thing that got some attention - https://twitter.com/ShefVaidya/status/1251818372343439361?s=...

But I assure you, this happens way more in small towns and villages.

Your Twitter reference has nothing to do with what you described above. Nice try with the rumor mill.

Very disingenuous reply, you can clearly see what happened in the video. Unconfirmed reports from different media sources (which hesitated to report this extensively for obvious reasons) indicated rumors from the fact that they were organ harvesting to that they were thieves etc.

It highlights that even with the police commissioner there, people can kill you for a rumour. So what is government enforcing if mob can take you apart for any reason they want?

If mob gets triggered by you criticising their cows or government (idk why blind patriotism is so widespread here), what would you do about your free speech if you get killed in the process with no enforcement against those who killed you or imagine a family member?

Honestly I am confused about free speech as well. Is the argument that government didn't stop you from criticising itself, just that the mob happens to kill you for it in public in the presence of the government make sense? Is that free speech?

Very less, people are routinely arrested for simple things like posting on FB on Twitter. And there is some Draconian sedition law, almost all critisim of government can be persecuted under that.

Also the freedom of speech guarantees are very watered down in comparison with the USA.

India has good free speech protections by law. In practice, there is very little tolerance.

As long as enough people submit to the "muh private company" idea, this will only get worse.

I am not sure what other options are there. Government owned companies? Because I don't see that working with [0] government censoring it's citizens and being so incompetent that it needs to have an internet shutdown all the time. Other countries face similar issues but they don't shut down the whole internet for their incompetence.

Indian government itself participates in disinformation campaigns, denies statistics coming from the outside (given india has done nothing on that front and only cut funding), practice blatant discrimination and spreads religious nonsense.

[0] https://internetshutdowns.in/

Oh and the nice bill - https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_Data_Protection_Bil...

Are you suggesting that we shouldn't have private companies?

No, what I think he is suggesting is that everything private companies do is defended to the extreme, just becasuse the alternative of having govt. controlled entities is undesirable.

Even I agree, there is too much worship of capitalist and free market structures.

There ought to be a good balance between free market and govt. regulations, where public interests in protected.

Yes, the people who worship capitalism are baffling, because corporate tyranny eventually becomes indistinguishable from government tyranny. For instance, if Facebook and Google became so pervasive that they could censor everything that everyone says, then our constitutional rights don't mean anything. I respect people's perspective most of the time, but I disrespect people who think that private companies have a license to do anything they want because it just doesn't seem to be a well thought out idea.

Then there are those who suddenly talk like free market capitalists when it's convenient to their politics. I see this all the time with whomever the balance of power is favoring. 15 years ago, it was conservatives who excused private companies that did things that liberals didn't like, as long as those companies appeared to align with their values or were at least agnostic, and now you'll hear liberals who otherwise hate capitalism pull out the "private company" card when it suits their goals or is an affront to the other side.

I believe very few people are actually interested in the public good. Everyone claims they want to do things for the public good. In reality, I think they all want whatever goodies they think they can get by acting as toadies for their party of choice.

There ought to be a balance between freedom and regulation, but this is increasingly becoming a minority opinion.

What is extreme nationalist ? India is a 5000 year old civilization.

Does banning triple talaq and medieval Islamic laws count as nationalism ?

Does bringing modern 21st century laws (including women equality and inheritance laws) to a territory given special status for merely political reasons count as nationalist ?

The condescending attitude is very off putting. If you base your opinions on the international media portrayal of Indian politics i would definitely say one thing is extremely lacking: nuance, it is mostly agenda driven drivel.

1)What does being a 5000 year old civilisation warrant anything? 2)You're just cherry picking points to your favour.

>What is extreme nationalist ? India is a 5000 year old civilization.

False, India as a country only existed since British rule before there were many waring states.

>Does banning triple talaq and medieval Islamic laws count as nationalism ?

No, but imposing tariff on Chinese steel is protectionism, having Special Economic Zones when you are above $1000 GDP per capita is offering unfair subsidy and harming global trade, there are many more of these acts slowly haemorrhaging economy, automobile sector went into debt citing higher cost of inputs (steel price went up as government added duty on Chinese exports) and now that industry is raking even more debt, inflating bubble and when this bubble will pop, you'll have strong of NPAs.

Can you explain 'extreme nationalist'. Im just curious, what qualities make a person or a leader as such?

Our leader is not an extremist nationalist. Next.

This is not a way to respond on HN. Please be respectful.

May be its just me, but I think calling a democratically elected leader of the most diverse country in the world, an extremist, is more disrespectful.

Its a first world thing.

They can overthrow a democratically elected government in Iran, and install a dictator, wage a war against Vietnam for more than a decade, meddle with south american nations wholesale, rub hands with despots like MBS of Suadi Arabia

and then come to the oldest civilization in the world, one of the most diverse, culturally rich society that has survived 200 years of Imperialist rule, an even more years under Islamist rape and plunder and looting, and then claim the democratically leader emerging from one of the biggest and universally agreed free and fair elections as 'extremely nationalist'.

If the leader of the country reflects the average joe of that country, I would gleefully point to trump.

The BJP and the RSS are literally nationalist.

Which is exactly why it gets problematic.

Nope

No one has problem with Hinduism. The problem is with Hindutva & bhakts.

No. This is a bland lie. What exactly about Hindutva dont you like?

What about Hindutva ideology do you find un acceptable?

RSS is a terrorist organisation.

Can we stop with name-calling, please?

Get Burnol.

> You know, I would argue India is a much more functional democracy than USA at the moment. Unfortunately, it isn't because India has suddenly become more democratic. Fortunately, we are at least not committing guillotine-level crimes. For example, we don't have the biggest businesses being bailed out while 20+ million people are simultaneously unemployed.

Whataboutism does nothing but add more misery.

And why are you asking people to assassinate mark Zuckerberg...on hn. Check the guidelines please.