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Re:Turning Off Autoplaying Previews by jfengel on Thursday February 06, 2020 @05:30PM (#22261161)
Netflix now has much better sources of information than the self-reported star ratings.

Self-reported ratings fail in a lot of ways. Users can upvote what they think they're supposed to upvote. They'll downvote something, then go watch the sequel, because "It's terrible but I love it". And since they're seeking out stuff that they suspect they're going to like, they either compress all of the ratings into the top tier, or they end up "hating" things that they actually thought were merely so-so.

I suspect that even the up-down ratings get little attention in their recommendation engine. They have far more information, especially in the streaming service. Did you watch all of it? Did you watch it all at once? Did you watch it more than once? Did you watch it immediately after discovering it?

That's all stuff that users can't fake or be confused about. You don't get users saying, "Citizen Kane is the greatest film of all time, but I really don't want to see it." It's more likely that you can tease out what it is that a user actually wants to see, rather than what they tell you they want.

Netflix did run a competition back in the DVD days, when they had less interaction with the user. They did get a slight improvement, but at about the same time, they introduced streaming, and a whole lot of Big Data techniques appeared that could take advantage of that new data.

So it wouldn't surprise me if the up/down buttons were completely ignored by the recommendation engine. Maybe it's just a reminder to you: "Oh, yeah, I did see that. It sucked."

The new system clearly misses some things, but a lot of the problem is that the DVD catalog is immense and full of classics, but the streaming catalog is weak and full of crap. The whole thing may be back-ported into the DVD recommendation engine, but that's the redheaded stepchild at Netflix these days. They tried to spin it off entirely.

Re:Turning Off Autoplaying Previews by reaperducer on Thursday February 06, 2020 @05:38PM (#22261222)
All current user ratings systems for movies are terrible because new users can bury a great movie.

There are classic, important, society-changing movies from the previous century that were highly praised by contemporary critics and won scads of awards. But then people today watch them with zero context or understanding of what was happening or what the world was like and give them bad ratings because they can only compare them to the latest shoot-em-up sequel of a sequel of a sequel.

It's one of the reasons Rotten Tomatoes is worthless for anything more than 20 years old, and why the voices of movie critics are needed so badly today.

See also: Yelp.

Re:Turning Off Autoplaying Previews by pjc50 on Thursday February 06, 2020 @05:45PM (#22261276)
What we need is something more like Amazon's old "people who liked this also liked"; we have to give up on the idea of a rating being an absolute thing for all time for all people. Some people want "critically acclaimed" movies, a lot of people don't. Both are valid.

The situation gets even worse from a diversity and internationalisation standpoint. You have to consider what different national and language groups want.

Re:Turning Off Autoplaying Previews by Dylan16807 on Friday February 07, 2020 @12:18AM (#22263433)
It's not supposed to be a measure of "greatness". It's there to predict how people will feel about the movie. If Netflix subscribers don't have the context to understand/appreciate the movie, then Netflix shouldn't recommend it to them.

That's the opposite of "worthless".

Re:Turning Off Autoplaying Previews by kace91 on Thursday February 06, 2020 @08:01PM (#22262204)
FilmAffinity is awesome for that - basically, after you vote a bunch of movies, it finds the N active users that voted most similarly, and then it offers you as recommendation whatever those people vote favorably that you haven't seen yet. You can actually see those selected people and filter them manually too.

The consequence is that you don't care about things like masses of teenage girls upvoting the latest vampire fad, people downvoting a classic because they don't understand the context or anything, because only your bubble matters to you. And if you fear that the bubble will keep you from discovering new things, there's a way to set up the algorithm to calculate your similar users so that they aren't exactly close to you - or you can go to a specific users profile if you know them and see what they're voting.

I find it amazing compared to IMDb or rottentomatoes, but for some reason I think it's mostly unknown outside of the Spanish speaking world.

Re:Turning Off Autoplaying Previews by PeterisP on Thursday February 06, 2020 @06:33PM (#22261617)
I'd like to explicitly make a point (your description seems to hint at it) that star ratings also indicate something orthogonal to liking stuff, something like segmentation of types of content.

Let's use a food analogy - I may go to a very fancy restaurant with exquisite food, and see that it holds up to its standards and is quite okay, and deserving all its stars. And in comparison I may have a basic hotdog or a sloppy burger, and admit that it's really nothing special, the fancy stuff was better, and that hotdog deserves less stars.... but at the same time that definitely does not mean that I always prefer the fancy stuff, and I can reasonably want that hotdog right now.

So that's the same with movie star ratings. I can at the same time agree that I liked movie A much better than movie B (and rank them accordingly), and I might re-watch movie A the fourth time and wouldn't bother with movie B ever... and at the same time not be in the mood for a complex movie like A, and want a simple, cheap, stupid movie similar to B, but with more explosions.

It's clear that 1 star sucks, but "5-star movies" and "4-star movies" perhaps simply indicate different genres of something roughly like "fancy" and "non-fancy" movies; and a fancy movie that's not really good doesn't get 4 stars but much worse; much like in the food analogy if the fancy restaurant serves something comparable in quality to that basic hotdog, it's not getting the same rating as the hot dog stand but much worse because of the unmet expectations.

Re:Turning Off Autoplaying Previews by frandroid on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @12:10AM (#22305984)
> They did get a slight improvement

Not only did the winning entry only bring in a slight improvement, and the payout followed suit, but they never actually used the winning algorithm.

Netflix's big winner for this contest, unplanned as it was, was their own recruiters and dev teams: Netflix became a company great developers wanted to work for because it cares about "hard problems".

Re:Turning Off Autoplaying Previews by gvjddbnvdrbv on Thursday February 06, 2020 @11:06PM (#22263138)
So why did their recommendations get so much worse?
Re:Turning Off Autoplaying Previews by jfengel on Friday February 07, 2020 @09:05AM (#22266008)
I believe it's mostly because their content got worse. It's hard to recommend good things when there are fewer good things there, and you've already seen all of the things you like.

They used to be alone in the space. Now they're competing with a lot of other services. Not in the DVD space, but I think they don't care about that space, and there are fewer people using it.

A lot of people suggest that there's another factor, that for streaming they pay different amounts for different content, and may not aim you at a movie that's expensive for them to show you. I have no idea if that's true.