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Re:What are your options for cognitive enhancement? by mistermann on Monday December 09, 2019 @11:30AM (#21743934)
I believe there are some flaws in your thinking, or at least the way you have articulated it in your comments. Hopefully this is received less as criticism, but more so as fine tuning or improvement of your ideas...

> Almost everyone that I meet who has done considerable, or even moderate, amounts of psychedelics has clear and obvious personality changes. Personality is a poor word to use, but something like their disposition, "hippy" attitude is extremely common.

How many samples have you based your conclusion on? Did all/most members belong to one common group of people (your subsequent comment suggests yes). Is it safe to assume all individuals will adopt this style of thinking, and to a similar degree that you've experienced?

> So much so that I think these drugs cause long term physical damage to peoples cognitive faculties.

May cause (I suspect you know this, but just making note of it).

> The most productive and successful people I meet almost always have been mostly sober their whole life, exhibiting balance and clear headedness.

How do you know they have been mostly sober their whole life?

> If psychedelics are doing any good, it is because those who are taking them are already so broken, any kind of change could be construed as positive.

This is a theory, with little if any supporting evidence (I suspect you know this, but just making note of it). My point is, stating theories as facts can alter the mental models of those who read your comments (which is likely the sort of thing going on with the group of friends you observed)

> Society tells us that anecdotal evidence is false, but that's brainwashing.

Here I very much agree.

> I can see with my own two my eyes what drugs do.

What drugs can do, as you've interpreted, in a very small set.

> Most likely certain areas of people brains are dampened or flattened by these drugs, and so if youre and anxious person, maybe you experience "relief", but that comes at a cost.

It comes at a cost sometimes. How frequent this is, and to what degree, is unknown. (I suspect you may know this, but here I am less confident).

> its very common for people on hacker news and elsewhere on the internet to argue against being able to extrapolate truth from subjective experiences.

Very much agree, and this thinking is so clearly incorrect that is frustrates me to encounter it so frequently among rational people.

> But like I was saying, what I have seen has been that psychedelic effects on peoples brains are often deterministic, many people who have taken too many end up with very similar psychological profiles and dispositions. Clearly there is something going on there. In some ways, part of the angst in my post arises from all of these different news articles popping up that talk about the positives of psychedelics, when neither the people writing the articles, nor those reading them probably know very many people with any experience.

I agree. These are powerful substances, are often taken far more lightly than they deserve, and opinions expressed on forums often lack epistemic humility.

Re:What are your options for cognitive enhancement? by TheOtherHobbes on Monday December 09, 2019 @12:04PM (#21744226)
The question is also how the cost compares to other potentially damaging activities and circumstances - including work stress as an employee, work stress as a founder, someone who is bankrupted by the health system, someone who abuses more common and popular drugs like cocaine and alcohol, and so on.

These are all at least as likely to lead to "deterministic" behavioural and emotional changes, not to mention direct physical health issues.

In a broader context, your implication that psychedelics are somehow uniquely dangerous because you disapprove of how they have affected a sample of people you know personally really doesn't stand up to wider scrutiny.

Re:What are your options for cognitive enhancement? by codingslave on Tuesday December 10, 2019 @09:06AM (#21752494)
Your argument here largely boils down to, "you are biased because anecdotal evidence." If you knew nothing about heroin, and then watched a bunch of people get addicted, you wouldn't say, "Well were they rich or poor? Could have been a biased sample set."
Re:What are your options for cognitive enhancement? by mistermann on Tuesday December 10, 2019 @12:20PM (#21754466)
Kind of. I'd say it's more than you are making an assertion of fact (conclusive truth) based on anecdotes that consider an insufficient number of variables and samples.

If you were instead expressing an opinion I'd have no complaint. Perhaps I've misinterpreted you?