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Re:Google hires firm known for anti-union efforts by quotemstr on Wednesday November 20, 2019 @05:48PM (#21589480)
> Yes, it is really evil for a corporation to disagree with the concept of unionisation

Corporations are made of people. Unions lose fair votes all the time. People who oppose unions are smart, honest, hard-working people who love their children and who just happen to have a difference of opinion with respect to policy. Are all of these people "evil"? Are they all morally unredeemable because they prefer a different kind of employee-employer relationship? It's bonkers how many people think the answer is "yes".

Deciding that anyone who disliked unionization is just evil is unlikely to be persuasive: instead, it'll just create division and bitterness and create conflict where there could have been cooperation.

Accepting the legitimacy of disagreement is a foundational aspect of a healthy,safe, and productive society. When you take that away, you're left with nothing but chaos.

Re:Google hires firm known for anti-union efforts by brmgb on Wednesday November 20, 2019 @07:30PM (#21590214)
>> Yes, it is really evil for a corporation to disagree with the concept of unionisation

> Corporations are made of people. [...] Deciding that anyone who disliked unionization is just evil

I only said corporations opposing unionisation are evil. I didn't say anything about people opposing unionisation. Corporations are not people. Personally I think people opposing unionisation are mostly deluded and often misinformed. I don't think they are evil however. People by themselves are rarely evil.

Corporations are owned by people and employ people. These two kinds of people have by design fundamentally different power inside the corporation. A corporation is an organisation whose purpose is to serve their owners goals (generally making money). From the point of view of the corporation, workers are merely an accessory to this goal.

Furthermore, the relationship between workers and corporation is a fundamentally asymmetric one. For the corporation, a single worker is pretty much always replaceable while for the worker the corporation is often is main source of income. Thus, without collective representation, a worker will always be at the mercy of its employer. That's why unions are so useful. They give employees a safe way to communicate with, negociate large change with and oppose their employer. Going against that for a corporation seems truly evil to me.

> it'll just create division and bitterness and create conflict where there could have been cooperation

What is workers cooperating together if not a union ? I think that's where the problem lies. From what I have seen Americans tend to have a rather narrow view of unions and remain unaware of the diversity existing in the world.

Apparently Americans tend to equal unions with mandatory membership, reserved jobs and fixed salary which is very far from the idea Europeans have of unions. In Germany for example, you will find unions with vastly different opinions and employees in a company are represented by a plurality of unions. In this context it is not too hard to find one close to what you believe in.

Re:Google hires firm known for anti-union efforts by blub on Thursday November 21, 2019 @02:27AM (#21592091)
I've seen this fake appeal to fairness so many times...

Disagreement is one thing. For example I'm disagreeing with you right now. But I'm not hiring a company that will follow you everywhere at work to try to convince you how wrong you are. And I don't have limitless financial resources to dedicate to proving you wrong and fend off any legal recourse you might attempt.

If I had and did the above I doubt you'd be so relaxed about the whole thing and call it disagreement.