Boeing whistleblower raises doubts over 787 oxygen system

Re:Boeing whistleblower raises doubts over 787 oxygen system by selectodude on Wednesday November 06, 2019 @08:51AM (#21462525)

More due to airlines demanding a new 737 instead of a new plane. Boeing already made a new 737, it’s called the 757 and nobody bought it.

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Re:Boeing whistleblower raises doubts over 787 oxygen system by cmurf on Wednesday November 06, 2019 @09:29AM (#21462892)

This. The consternation and blame direct at Boeing, while appropriate, distracts from the real source of the problem: airlines. And Southwest Airlines was possibly one of the largest sources of the 737 MAX negative incentives, by having a contract reportedly require $1 million per airplane if a certain threshold of pilot training was exceeded. And to this day Southwest still doesn't think MAX specific simulator training is necessary for pilots.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-boeing-airplane-southwest...

https://www.bizjournals.com/dallas/news/2019/07/29/southwest...

That's especially incredible considering Southwest pilots' union says in a lawsuit that the 737 MAX is unsafe.

https://www.seattletimes.com/business/boeing-aerospace/in-sc...

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Re:Boeing whistleblower raises doubts over 787 oxygen system by CaptainZapp on Wednesday November 06, 2019 @10:36AM (#21463539)

The consternation and blame direct at Boeing, while appropriate, distracts from the real source of the problem: airlines. And Southwest Airlines was possibly one of the largest sources of the 737 MAX negative incentives, by having a contract reportedly require $1 million per airplane if a certain threshold of pilot training was exceeded

Well, in this case I'd argue that it was totally Boeing's responsibility to communicate to such customers that they couldn't do it.

Instead they nodded their heads, demanded the impossible from their engineers, demoted or fired people that questioned it and in the end offered a hacked solution, which killed over 300 people.

I don't think that your argument excuses their culpability in any way, shape or form.

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Re:Boeing whistleblower raises doubts over 787 oxygen system by cmurf on Wednesday November 06, 2019 @02:12PM (#21465934)

In no possible reading of what I wrote is there an excuse for Boeing's culpability. I'm suggesting split culpability.

If I offer you $1 million to shoot someone, and you go do that, two crimes have been committed. Pointing out that I'm also culpable in no way excuses your culpability. I would be the real source of the crime, as the instigator, having set out a strong incentive to commit the crime against your otherwise better judgement.

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Re:Boeing whistleblower raises doubts over 787 oxygen system by chipsa on Wednesday November 06, 2019 @11:16AM (#21463967)

It's actually a bit worse than that. American Airlines actually announced the "new" 737 variant before Boeing was even thinking of it[0]. At which point Boeing needed to figure out how to make the next 737 happen.

[0] http://news.aa.com/news/news-details/2011/AMR-Corporation-An...

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Re:Boeing whistleblower raises doubts over 787 oxygen system by selectodude on Wednesday November 06, 2019 @11:47AM (#21464277)

Boeing was all in on building a clean-sheet replacement for the 737 up to like 2011 until American said basically "we're not buying any new planes unless they're 737s and we'll re-standardize on Airbus". Boeing still shouldn't have built it (you don't need to be an aerospace engineer to see where the issues were going to be) but talk about being put into a "coffin corner" (ha ha).

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Re:Boeing whistleblower raises doubts over 787 oxygen system by dgemm on Wednesday November 06, 2019 @11:08AM (#21463893)

The 757 was made to replace the 727 and serves a different market segment than the 737.

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Re:Boeing whistleblower raises doubts over 787 oxygen system by selectodude on Wednesday November 06, 2019 @11:38AM (#21464202)

I think you're missing the point, here. The 757 was a 727 replacement because the 737 was never meant to be flying the routes and carrying the pax that it is today. The 737 MAX 10 has become, pax wise, a direct competitor of the 757-200. Airlines are demanding a 757 that doesn't require a new type rating, which is how you get this frankensteins monster of an airplane.

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Re:Boeing whistleblower raises doubts over 787 oxygen system by DayDollar on Wednesday November 06, 2019 @02:01PM (#21465804)

Now, now, frankensteins monster could hold its ballance and had two sensors to sense the pitchfork wielding crowd.

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