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Re:Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests e... by saluki on Thursday October 17, 2019 @09:54AM (#21282050)
of course I do, it's alluded to in my comment: "(beyond what smartphones are already capable of)"

I agree, smart phones provide the same surveillance capabilities of 'smart' speakers and more.

But supposedly phones aren't always on and listening to all your audio like the 'smart' speakers.

This might just be a divide in society, some people accept surveillance as not an issue and are fine with it.

Would you place a similar 'smart' speaker device in your home if the government suddenly required it?

I just feel a surveillance state is detrimental to freedom and democracy, the freedom we have in the states is not common.

If you look back in history and even around the world today it's pretty rare. I just want to make sure we aren't setting ourselves up to weaken it or even lose it.

Re:Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests e... by streb-lo on Thursday October 17, 2019 @10:03AM (#21282139)
> But supposedly phones aren't always on and listening to all your audio like the 'smart' speakers.

New phones are.

Also, AFAIK, Alexa et al. are only sending traffic home after the wake word is heard. I believe this has been confirmed via wireshark.

Re:Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests e... by skrause on Thursday October 17, 2019 @10:26AM (#21282398)
> New phones are.

But it's a setting. I own an iPhone have turned off "Hey Siri". If it would still listen all the time that would be a security issue and breach of trust.

Re:Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests e... by saluki on Thursday October 17, 2019 @10:13AM (#21282247)
That's true a phone has 'smart' speaker features.

It seems 'smart' speakers wake more easily than Siri.

We hadn't been hearing news stories about FANG employees listening to/reviewing conversations intimate moments until the 'smart' speakers were deployed.

I expect this could have been going on with Siri as well though.

I'm open to using a 'smart' speaker in the future, there might not be any reason for concern.

Currently it just seems like a bad idea to add recording devices you don't control around your home.

Re:Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests e... by scatters on Thursday October 17, 2019 @11:39AM (#21283196)
> We hadn't been hearing news stories about FANG employees listening to/reviewing conversations intimate moments until the 'smart' speakers were deployed.

That just shows that the media didn't think those stories would sell.

Re:Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests e... by hannasanarion on Thursday October 17, 2019 @11:49AM (#21283304)
> New phones are.

Not new Android phones. Since Android 8, google no longer listens while the phone is locked. If you want to use the google assistant, you have to give your fingerprint or password first.

Re:Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests e... by AlanYx on Thursday October 17, 2019 @11:08AM (#21282832)
after the wake word is heard

It's more accurate to say "after the wake word is heard or after a false positive for the wake word is heard".

Even in the presence of hardware interlocks (active when the wake word has not been detected), the accuracy of wake word detection is a really important question, as is the question of whether an adversary can modify the wake word detection code remotely.

Re:Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests e... by pgodzin on Thursday October 17, 2019 @11:08AM (#21282838)
They use the exact same hotword detection - that is all they are "always listening" for (obviously plenty of false positives that can still capture other conversations)
Re:Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests e... by davinic on Thursday October 17, 2019 @10:10AM (#21282220)
But saying "beyond what smartphones are already capable of" diminishes the fact that they are also always listening, and are also generally near where you are. Siri, by default, is always listening. Most people don't understand or know this. People are then amazed when they put their phone on a table and say "Hey Siri" from across the room.
Re:Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests e... by eeZah7Ux on Thursday October 17, 2019 @10:55AM (#21282696)
It's very different. Smart speakers are much better at invading privacy.
Re:Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests e... by davinic on Thursday October 17, 2019 @11:36AM (#21283170)
No one has yet to provide an argument as to why "smart speakers are much better at invading privacy".

For example, just this year my always-on, always-near-me iPhone was subject to an attack where anyone could call me on FaceTime and gain access to my microphone. This attack vector does not exist on my Google Home.

So, why are smart speakers much better at invading privacy?

Re:Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests e... by eeZah7Ux on Tuesday October 22, 2019 @09:04AM (#21323121)
Smart speakers are designed to listen, obviously!

Streaming audio is not seen as suspicious.

Also they aren not phones and not using wifi, not LTE/4G uplinks, making it more easy to stream audio without hitting bandwidth caps or using too much battery.

It's way much easier to notice if a phone streams audio often and unnecessarily.

Re:Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests e... by close04 on Thursday October 17, 2019 @12:04PM (#21283454)
Smart speakers are made to listen by design, that's their sole purpose: to listen and respond to that. Disabling the microphone takes away the core functionality and basically their purpose for being. You're left with a speaker.

For a phone the assistant is an optional side-feature and disabling it takes almost nothing away from the utility of the smartphone. You're still left with a smartphone.

Re:Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests e... by Aunche on Thursday October 17, 2019 @10:14AM (#21282261)
If you believe that your smartphone isn't always on, wouldn't it make sense that your smart speaker is also off until you give it a wake word?
Re:Google chief: I'd disclose smart speakers before guests e... by fyfy18 on Thursday October 17, 2019 @10:22AM (#21282342)
No, because it's a small step from having a smart speaker - which is specifically designed to pick up someone speaking quietly from the other side of the room - to go from "requiring a wake work" to "listening to every conversation". Especially when the companies involved (Google and Amazon specifically) have direct interests in knowing what you are talking about.