Re:Number theorist fears many proofs widely considered to be...
by lolc on Sunday September 29, 2019 @02:53PM
(#21108919)
People struggle with monads because it's a two-step process to learn them: Learn their mathematical properties, then learn how to apply them as a pattern. That's not a quick process you can do in half an hour. It doesn't help that the concept is alien to everyday processes. So yeah, analogy doesn't get you far with monads.
Re:Number theorist fears many proofs widely considered to be...
by chongli on Sunday September 29, 2019 @03:59PM
(#21109303)
I think most monad tutorials skip over the math and try to teach people the applications and I think this is why people don’t get very far. But then people are probably not ready for the math if they haven’t gone beyond high school algebra. Very few high school students learn about abstract algebra topics such as group theory unless they’re studying on their own.
Aside: as with monads, group theory has many disparate applications, from solving Rubik’s cubes [1] to particle physics [2] to crystallography [3]. Trying to teach someone group theory using only a Rubik’s cube may not be the best idea, in light of the abstract nature of the structure.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rubik%27s_Cube_group
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Particle_physics_and_represent...
[3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crystallographic_point_group
Re:Number theorist fears many proofs widely considered to be...
by yaccz on Tuesday October 01, 2019 @08:51AM
(#21124745)
> As a math student, I would much prefer to be given a basic statement of the definition of a monad, a list of properties, and maybe a theorem to prove that some structure is a monad instead of having to fall back to the definition.
Have you looked into the original paper?
https://homepages.inf.ed.ac.uk/wadler/papers/marktoberdorf/b...
One example I see frequently around here is the much-maligned monad tutorial. Writers keep trying to connect it by analogy to concepts with which imperative programmers are already familiar. As a math student, I would much prefer to be given a basic statement of the definition of a monad, a list of properties, and maybe a theorem to prove that some structure is a monad instead of having to fall back to the definition. From there, I would just work through a few exercises and start to understand what it is and how it works. Most people don’t work this way, however. People seem to be extremely resistant to learning by experimentation. Instead, they prefer to be given all the answers.
I suppose this isn’t really a problem that’s unique to math. We’ve also discussed how a lot of computer users fail to truly understand how the software works and instead prefer to follow steps by rote in order to carry out one particular task.