But I you really try to remember, but can't overcome your programming (I do that often with my non-binary acquaintances, it's hard as fuck, but I guess I'm getting old as well ¯\_(ツ)_/¯) then you are a human being that tries to be respectful. And that's a good thing! So take a look in the mirror and try to see which one you are and ignore those disrespectful human beings that would call you a creep for not remembering.
BTW as I have long blond hair I'm called madam quite often and learned not to be bothered by it though I'm a cis hetero white male. Furthermore it comes often from children, who speak the truth as everyone knows. So grow a spine and fight, don't nag everyone else to be nice. People aren't nice. The world isn't any more just than we make it. And lynching (even symbolically) isn't the way to get a just world. Victims aren't noble. Fighters are. See Malcolm X. MLK. Rosa Luxemburg. Daniel Guérin.
Have you ever been forced to use a women's bathroom because of your, probably fabulous, hair?
On the other hand, how many different toilets should there be in your world? Should non transgender women be allowed in women's toilets? That has been an actual question and an actual problem to solve in the world of infinitely exploded communities of precious snowflakes (in the very same order of absurdity, should veiled white women allowed in "coloured women only" meetings? what about transgender black women?).
As food for thought, if you believe that, as a white cis male, I'm a born oppressor, I've also been actually harassed, publicly humiliated, attacked and beaten for being "a fag" (you know, long blond hair), because homophobes don't really care about who you actually are, and also beaten for defending women harassed on the street (because machos/sexists are also generally violent).
In the global competition for victimhood, nobody can win. Who knows what humiliations RMS was subjected to for being ugly, fat, an asocial geek, etc. Maybe he used the power he has in some sets and circumstances in despicable ways. But so do the students at Evergreen, because that's just what human beings do. Being an aggressor or a victim is mostly circumstantial for most people.
Do you think that the person who looked at you and proceeded to call you a fag showed you respect?
I've worked for a doctor doing sex change treatments, a long time ago. I've seen people that suffered incredibly. Some of them looked like caricatures, but that was certainly not funny. I took, naturally, great care in calling them "sir" or "madam" as they expected (and it sometimes required actual effort, and it was poignant and upsetting just thinking of the looks these persons must have received back outdoors).
However I don't feel like wanting to be called some very special pronoun that nobody ever heard of because you're oh so special falls into the same category. I don't feel that people wanting to be in their own very special niche class of genre, race or whatever category is sane, good and healthy, or some form of progress. Happiness isn't finding some form of very individualistic achievement.
1) That's not a feeling, that's an opinion. 2) And really? Do you think you have the answer to how people should find "happiness". Then you should write one more book on the subject and become another self help millionaire. You seem appropriately sure of yourself so, go nuts!
This seems acceptable to me. Stallman has always been weird with word choice but I see no bad intent here.
And to other's that seems like he doesn't respect the wishes of others and instead behaves in a way that is logically sound in his own mind. That's not a crime. Just a disrespectful way of behaving that generates antagonists instead of friends.
Side note: "per" is very funny to me as a swede since it's a super common traditionally(exclusively?) male name.
Please define "others". It should be a definition that is not only "transgender people". Could it be "all the people in the world that is not you"?
If so, it is impossible to please them all. Some will contradict each other. It will generate antagonists or you will be seen as rude whenever you want it or not.
So you may decide you will be siding and pleasing those "others" who are "right" (based on your personal preference only). But at the same time, not everyone who is "not right" is necessarily "wrong".
I'm not siding with anyone, and I won't tell if I use or not special pronouns. But today the discussion is about pronouns. Tomorrow, who knows? Up to where are you willing to bend?
That goes both ways though.
I'd be more wary of the people with low integrity who just say what others want to hear, they change their speech but doesn't actually change their behavior and will still discriminate and undermine groups even when forced to change their speech pattern.
Stallman seems to me like a person with an extremely high level of integrity, if a normal person believe that voluntary pedophilia is fine they would just shut up and join the mob but not Stallman. He faced his world view head on and no longer believe that pedophilia is fine, and we can be pretty sure that he actually changed since he doesn't buckle to pressure. The same can not be said about most politicians and other conventional leaders.
I don't really understand this. When I'm talking to an adopted child, I have no trouble calling their parents their parents, even though they're objectively guardians. When I'm dining with religious folks, I have no trouble saying "Amen" or some such phrase from their religion despite me being an atheist.
Saying something you don't objectively believe out of consideration for others' feelings is normal, and it's fairly basic manners.
Yep, they're the worst in my book as well.
How is that not respecting others?
One could also make claim that choosing some ridiculous new pronoun is disrespectful of others. People were content with he/she for thousands of years and some could consider inventing new ones similar to 1984's Newspeak.
Of course, but that hypothetical person who put forward this claim doesn't subscribe to the generally accepted definition of respect so I don't see why we should discuss that person.
Ok. Now I understand. Read my comment again. We're talking about hypotetical person A who claims that another hypothetical B person who wants to be called by a ridiculous pronoun is disrespectful.
A says that B is disrespectful.
I said that it is A who doesn't know what respect is.
Sorry that you got confused.
> Respect, also is called esteem, is a positive feeling or action shown towards someone or something considered important, or held in high esteem or regard. It conveys a sense of admiration for good or valuable qualities. And it is also the process of honoring someone by exhibiting care, concern, or consideration for their needs or feelings.
My emphasis. I don't know if you define "respect" in your own way or you only care about people's feeling if they have a certain skill level or have achieved/contributed enough.
I haven't met someone yet who has preferences outside of that. But you know what? If I met one, it would cost me virtually nothing to respect their preferences and make them feel seen.
And to be clear -- it's absolutely fine (usually) to make mistakes, so long as you're making an effort to be respectful. It's not ideal to not remember someone's pronouns (and again, 99% of the time when it's different than what you'd expect, it's either "he", "she", or "they"), but it's also usually not the end of the world -- most people I know, myself included, are fine if you say "oops! my bad".
Intentions go a long way.
I thought I covered that in 2 ways...
1) Random thoughts from an old guy
2) I was giving an example of the differences between people.
I have been chastised in the past for saying bless you to some people. I've kind of trained myself now to say "Maay the diety of your choice bless you" in some cirumstances but I also get chastised for that. I've also been chastised for remaining silent. So, what choice do I make here to not be "creepy".
For whatever it's worth.
I always say "gesundheit", which is normal in German (it translates to "health"). As a non-religious person, I don't understand why religious people always want to push religion on everyone around them.
The other thing you can do is just not say anything at all when someone sneezes. Asian cultures don't have this practice at all.
I'm not religious at all and I still say "bless you" since it's from the culture I grew up with of wishing others well. If anyone finds that offensive then they certainly have more issues than I do.
You're not just wishing them better health; you're wishing that your preferred deity magically give them better health. So you're pushing your faith in that deity on that person.
>I'm not religious at all and I still say "bless you" since it's from the culture I grew up
The culture I grew up in (America, specifically the South) does the same thing. It also has other great things in its "culture", like murdering black people with nooses during the Jim Crow days, and generally being intolerant of people who are different. "The culture I grew up in" is not a good excuse for bad behavior, and that includes pushing religion on people.
As for culture, sure, every single one is at some point guilty of crimes against humanity such as in my country [1], [2], etc and we must be able to look past those things as otherwise it's impossible to change for the better.
We will be different, have different beliefs, different sexuality, different colours of skin, and different languages to convey our thoughts. If we continue to see even an act of kindness as hostile then I don't have much hope people will ever get over differences. It shouldn't be different if they're Christian, Sunni, or any else and extend their greeting in their way to you along with their own way of wishing you well. What matters most is the intention rather than if they're from the same faith as you.
[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compulsory_sterilisation_in_Sw... [2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midsummer_crisis
This may come as a shock to you, but there's a lot of people in the world who don't have any "preferred deity", and really don't appreciate religious people trying to push their myths on them.
>It's rather sad that even an act of kindness is now seen as bad behaviour simply from refusal to accept that we have different ways of showing it.
This reminds me of Christians who want to give food to starving people, but only if they sit and listen to some stupid sermon trying to get them to convert.
If you want to be kind, then don't tie your "act of kindness" to your belief system in an attempt to convert others to it.
This is generally an American problem too. Other cultures, even when they do have a religion, don't really care about pushing it on others. Even in Europe, most modern-day Christians there seem to keep their religion very private (hence why Germans say "gesundheit" when someone sneezes, even though Germany is traditionally a Christian country).
Well I live in Europe as I'm Swedish; in the UK it's common to say "bless you" while in Sweden we usually say "prosit" (the two I've spent a significant portion of my life in). The former would even be from those not following Christian traditions but rather as stated before. This seems to reflect the trend in quite a few others in Europe such as Spain, Ireland, Wales (UK), etc.
Again, most of it isn't an attempt at "converting" or even some other hidden motive. It may be different in other parts of the world but from the places I've lived in Europe it's been as I've stated.
I struggle with names at times...
And now pronouns? Uhhhh, I bet I screw it up more than 50% of the time. The differences in people (don't say god bless you you to some indians or muslims when they sneeze, for example) are more than I can keep track of at times. Does that make me a creep?
There was one guy his chose "The Great and Powerful <something>" for his pronoun. Yeah, I'll remember that...
At what point do you become a creep for not remembering? At what point do you become a target for the SJW hit squad?