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Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by graphememes on Thursday August 29, 2019 @05:52PM (#20834074)
Being in the bay area, I have witnessed what you expressed happen to many engineers since the legalization. They burn out quickly as well. They swear it's not weed since everyone else tells them that's all tinfoil hat stuff.

It's very unfortunate.

Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by mrlala on Thursday August 29, 2019 @06:14PM (#20834242)
Are the engineers you are referring to in developing brain stages? You are replying to OP who said from 16-18.. that is still fairly prime development.. your bay area engineers are probably mid 20's? That is quite different when we are talking about brain development.
Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by qzx_pierri on Thursday August 29, 2019 @06:41PM (#20834427)
They're probably referring to someone who starts getting high everyday, and quickly becomes "smoked out" - We all know someone like this. I used to get high a lot (when I was 21-23), and I stopped because I noticed myself becoming a shell of who I once was. When I wasn't high, nothing was fun anymore. It started off as saying things like "Bro this would be so much more fun if I was stoned", or "Dude, imagine getting high and then doing X' - This soon turned into "I'm so bored. This would be more interesting if I was high".

Soon, I wasn't happy until I picked up an eighth and rolled up a blunt or packed my bowl. When I would stop, I would feel so numb. I soon got depressed, but luckily found a counselor and worked through that dark time with exercise and meditation. People really downplay how damaging getting high all the time can be.

It's strange though, because this doesn't happen to everyone. Some people can get stoned all day everyday and live a very happy, productive life. I wish I was in this category, but nothing good lasts forever.

Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by birdyrooster on Thursday August 29, 2019 @10:50PM (#20835593)
I'll throw my hat in as one of those that has been smoked out practically 24/7 for the last seven years and haven't experienced these symptoms working at various big name tech companies as software engineer. I am glad to hear things are going better for you now!
Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by verall on Friday August 30, 2019 @03:44AM (#20836613)
(explaining my vouch - I wish I could choose to auto-collapse my own comment as meta/unsubstiative)

Other posters have thrown in personal annecdotes in more words but this one is against the prevailing narrative so it's dead.

Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by o-__-o on Thursday August 29, 2019 @11:30PM (#20835761)
Weed effects last for up to 8 hours. Weed messes with REM cycles. This means weed should be treated like coffee (no usage after 4pm) and obviously not before going to work. Meaning the best times to smoke are weekends and holidays, preferably right after you wake up at a normal hour (7-8am)
Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by massaman_yams on Friday August 30, 2019 @05:22PM (#20842846)
From the report linked to in this commment https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20833229

"There is moderate evidence that cannabis or cannabinoids are effective for: • Improving short-term sleep outcomes in individuals with sleep disturbance associated with obstructive sleep apnea syndrome, fibromyalgia, chronic pain, and multiple sclerosis"

That's not everybody, of course, but it's enough to say that weed can have positive effects on sleep quality.

Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by o-__-o on Friday August 30, 2019 @10:04PM (#20844200)
Negative, doc.

In the article you cite, cannabis can help when your sleep cycle is _already_ f'ed. But then you have to have a real long talk with yourself and ask why? Why, when there are better medicines to manage sleep disturbance in the short term which actually improves your sleep. (I am genuinely asking, even OTC sleep medicines will work better than weed)

Weed cannot have positive effects for the layperson because it increases time between REM cycles. Again, if your lack of sleep affects your REM cycle (i.e. its already f'd) then you are doing no harm, but you are not doing much good either.

Maybe you missed my original comment. If you are getting a full 8 hours of sleep every night then you should _not_ be drinking caffeine after 4pm. Likewise, you should also NOT drink alcohol before bed. Further, weed, the topic of this thread, should be avoided after 4pm due to its prolonged effects on your body including impact to REM sleep.

Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by strlen on Thursday August 29, 2019 @06:57PM (#20834527)
I believe the aforementioned engineers are simply experiencing the effects of marijuana: both acute intoxication and symptoms associated with regular use. If they're healthy adults in mid 20s, then these symptoms should go away within 1-2 weeks of discontinuing use - problem is they don't view their symptoms as associated with routine use.

That said, seeking to be routinely intoxicated could itself a symptom of something else wrong in their work or personal life. This would be a non-controversial statement to make about "hard drugs", alcohol, video games, risky relationships, etc...

Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by sharadov on Thursday August 29, 2019 @07:23PM (#20834656)
Exactly, you can smoke a joint and go hike/ride a bike or you can sit your ass on the couch and be toking up bowl after bowl!
Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by strlen on Friday August 30, 2019 @01:57AM (#20836260)
Don’t ride a bike: first motor and response times are impacted, second (at least in California) you absolutely can get a DUI on a bicycle.
Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by jotm on Friday August 30, 2019 @05:46AM (#20837113)
People drive high. I can't believe how many times I've heard "I can drive just fine, it's not like alcohol".

Cannabis changes my perception of time and significantly affects my attention. I would never drive in that state, or even cross the street, I'm sure I'd get hit by a car... I don't think other people are that different.

Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by TomMarius on Friday August 30, 2019 @07:11AM (#20837488)
Chronic weed usage changes the way you're high. The time distortion nearly goes away and you can control your attention pretty well. I'm not endorsing driving high of course.
Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by dkersten on Friday August 30, 2019 @07:28AM (#20837560)
From watching chronic weed smoking friends... I do not believe this. If anything, they're much worse and much scarier more dangerous while driving. They definitely should not ever drive high.
Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by TomMarius on Friday August 30, 2019 @09:56AM (#20838620)
Isn't that because they're also thinking they're invincible and can handle it, so the weed usage does not actually cause their driving behavior? At least that's the case with my own acquintances who drive high. As I said, I also don't think it should be allowed to drive high, however the effect long term usage has on a person is genuine, albeit definitely not generalizable - I'm pretty sure the strain is an important factor.
Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by dkersten on Saturday August 31, 2019 @07:47AM (#20845764)
From my own observations, it was more that their reaction times were much slowed down and their depth and distance perception affected. I know one guy who crashed into a object while high. Luckily he wasn’t driving fast and nobody got hurt.
Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by TomMarius on Sunday September 01, 2019 @04:00PM (#20854479)
By the way, the Czech police says "you can spot a high driver by how unusually carefully they drive".
Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by sharadov on Thursday August 29, 2019 @07:21PM (#20834642)
That's profoundly sad. But I don't blame the drug, people need to figure out boundaries.
Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by donw on Thursday August 29, 2019 @09:04PM (#20835128)
That requires clear and honest guidance as to where those boundaries might lie, though.

Broadly speaking, I am pro-legalization of Pretty Much Everything, on the basis that proper education and appropriate treatment programs for heroin users are better for society than jail time.

But that comes with the need to implement pragmatic, evidence-based policies for how we approach drug use as a society.

A lot of neural development happens before your mid-20s, with a very large chunk happening during your adolescent years. Recreational drug use before your mid-20s, which includes alcohol and nicotine, really has a massive impact on your entire life.

I would argue that "soft" drugs, like low-percentage alcohol (beer and wine), maybe cocoa tea (not purified cocaine), and possibly low-percentage CBD should be relatively safe for adolescents from sixteen onwards.

Medical professionals, feel free to chime in if I'm wrong here. :)

Hard alcohol, nicotine, cocaine, and such, on the other hand, should have some access barrier for those under the age of twenty-five (90th percentile for complete neural development).

I wouldn't advocate an outright ban or criminalization -- if a teenager wants some weed and vodka, they're going to get it -- but putting some barriers in place to discourage consumption for the under-aged would be wise.

All of this, of course, needs to be coupled with comprehensive education.

The abstinence-only approach of "Just Say No" doesn't equip kids to really understand the full impact of the drugs they choose to use, and because of that, there's a lot of misinformation out there, ranging from "weed will make you crazy" to "it's completely safe for kids".

Neither of those things is true, and if we want to empower people to make good decisions, we must first be honest with them about the impact and trade-offs of the options on the table.

Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by sharadov on Friday August 30, 2019 @12:02AM (#20835886)
That's the libertarian approach, which says legalize everything, tax everything. Am with you on it, although am not sure, how that would work with hard drugs ( cocaine,mushrooms,LSD, ecstasy,heroin). Again within hard drugs - cocaine is vastly different from doing LSD. A single dose of LSD in a bad setting could mess your psyche up for life. What you are doing is choosing the better of two evils.I would rather buy a pure form of LSD from Pfizer that one from a street dealer with a nefarious source and containing crap knows what!
Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by donw on Friday August 30, 2019 @12:29AM (#20835983)
I'd say more pragmatic than purely libertarian. :)

You still need a regulatory framework, and I would strongly argue for compulsory education on drug use, not to mention treatment programs, all of which should be funded through use taxes.

Otherwise, though, I agree very much with the libertarians that that empowering individuals to make their own life-choices is far more beneficial to society than criminalization and prohibition.

Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by sharadov on Friday August 30, 2019 @12:35AM (#20836004)
I think when you give people the facts and remove the stigma and the "mystery" surrounding drugs, you will get people to start making wise choices - to counteract it you need a sound education policy, not the fear-mongering that goes in the name of education now.
Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by tryitnow on Friday August 30, 2019 @11:28AM (#20839529)
Thanks for making that distinction. I think the purely libertarian approach has the risk to do more harm than good.

Without education, social support, and access to mental health care, a drug free-for-all could very well lead to such disastrous results that there is a backlash that returns us right back to criminalization and prohibition.

Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by dkersten on Friday August 30, 2019 @07:25AM (#20837549)
One thing to note is that most weed strains now are very high in THC and low in CBD. Naturally, they were much more balanced and I think high-THC might be part of the problem and consuming more balanced (and lower percentage) strains may be much better. Anecdotally, I definitely find that higher less balanced strains give me more of a brain fog than weaker more balanced strains (less balanced strains but taking CBD pills separately to balance it out even works too).

I mean, heavy use either way may be bad and boundaries are important with anything (weed, beer, chocolate, etc), but smoking the strongest stuff may be extra bad.

Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by sharadov on Friday August 30, 2019 @09:19AM (#20838261)
I read somewhere that the percentage of THC now is almost 10X what it used to be in the 70s.
Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by ksaj on Friday August 30, 2019 @03:43PM (#20841906)
Exactly this, but also in terms of fats, sugars and caffeine.
Re:U.S. Surgeon General’s Advisory: Marijuana Use and the De... by chillwaves on Friday August 30, 2019 @11:53AM (#20839772)
Do these folks drink? I know a lot of stressed out workers who drink heavily.