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Re:Car theft by relaying signals from wireless keys by JonnieCache on Friday January 07, 2011 @07:44AM (#2079375)
Surely car design/manufacture is much harder than implementing proven crypto? The mind boggles. Crypto is a solved problem as far as protecting passwords goes. How can such huge companies continue to get it wrong?

If I made cars, I'd make sure I'd solved this problem on my products, then buy some TV adverts showing thieves in carparks bumping other manufacturers locks wirelessly with ease. Perhaps backed by graceful classical music. Try and make it look like the advert was bought by my rivals and aimed at car thieves.

Although that might be asking for it...

Re:Car theft by relaying signals from wireless keys by gvb on Friday January 07, 2011 @09:49AM (#2079675)
"Broken" is correct, but arguably too strong of a term. It is a man-in-the-middle attack, where the "man" in the middle is relaying the signals without modification and with an extremely short delay between the "key" and the car.

The article notes that their system specifically delays the challenge/response by nanoseconds vs. milliseconds by staying in the analog realm because doing a A/D -> Tx -> Rx -> D/A sequence added too much delay.

This implies either the car security system either measures the challenge/response delay or could measure it in which case this MitM attack still will work since attack's nSec delays will be very difficult to detect.

Most relay attacks require the signals to be converted from analog to digital and back, which takes time. The researchers were able to keep the signals in analog format, which reduced their delay from microseconds to nanoseconds and made their attack more difficult to detect.

Re:Car theft by relaying signals from wireless keys by varjag on Friday January 07, 2011 @08:25AM (#2079443)
> Surely car design/manufacture is much harder than implementing proven crypto?

No crypto is broken in this scenario.

Re:Car theft by relaying signals from wireless keys by JonnieCache on Friday January 07, 2011 @12:54PM (#2080303)
Keeping track of your secrets is as essential a part of a crypto implementation as the algorithm used. As I understand it, they could have used something like this: https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Socialist_mil...

EDIT: I understand now, having read more carefully, about how this particular MITM attack works. Nasty. The only solution would seem to be to give up some convenience.