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Re:BART slows rollout of new trains as it contends with more... by pmoriarty on Sunday July 28, 2019 @08:18AM (#20547137)
About 20 to 25 years ago, I took a trip from the US (where I'd lived most of my life) to travel around Europe by train, and I was immensely impressed by its far superior train system. The best trains of all the countries I visited were in Sweden, which had trains which were so modern that they seemed like something out of the future, even compared to the best trains I'd seen in the US by that time, Amtrak trains.

The new BART trains that are only now rolling out remind me a lot of the Swedish trains I saw more than 20 years ago, except that the BART trains have flat panel screens in them that I doubt those Swedish trains had back then, but the Swedish trains had doors that would silently and easily slide open when you held your hands up to them -- that was something that had greatly impressed me back then, because all the trains I'd been to before had really heavy doors that you'd have to struggle with to open by hand, while on the Swedish trains you just held your hand up and the doors would glide open like on the spacecraft on Star Trek.

The whole experience had left me embarrassed for the US, which I'd seen as a technological leader up to that point. I came away from that trip with an impression that the US was very backwards in many ways. The train system and train differences were just one glaring example, but also politically and in many other ways the US was very backwards.

Now finally these new BART trains rolling out, some NYC trains were also modernizing some about a decade ago, but I haven't been to Sweden or much of the rest of Europe in a long time, and I wonder how much further they've progressed.

Re:BART slows rollout of new trains as it contends with more... by hyperbovine on Sunday July 28, 2019 @09:08AM (#20547329)
It’s not really a fair comparison. In terms of where people actually live (the upper two thirds of Sweden is almost empty) its roughly comparable to Ohio: about ten million people clustered in 4 or 5 major cities within a few hours drive distance from each other. Of course it will be easier to provide superior rail service there. This is not so say that Ohio has its act together as far as public transit is concerned (ha), but getting that level of service to the US as a whole would be a totally different beast.
Re:BART slows rollout of new trains as it contends with more... by mktmkr on Sunday July 28, 2019 @04:15PM (#20549605)
Can we just start with Ohio? Ohio has the population density of Spain and twice the GDP per capita, but it lacks passenger rail service almost entirely.
Re:BART slows rollout of new trains as it contends with more... by closeparen on Sunday July 28, 2019 @04:53PM (#20549793)
Columbus has an average commute time of 21.8 minutes [0], among the best in America. Would public transit do better? Is it a good use of funds to replace what’s working well?

https://storage.googleapis.com/titlemax-media/2018/03/averag...

Re:BART slows rollout of new trains as it contends with more... by mktmkr on Sunday July 28, 2019 @05:37PM (#20549959)
I thought we were talking about inter-city rather than commuter service. Columbus to Cincinnati for example.
Re:BART slows rollout of new trains as it contends with more... by mhb on Sunday July 28, 2019 @09:25AM (#20547414)
Is there any Ohio-sized area in the US that has a system comparable to the Swedish one?
Re:BART slows rollout of new trains as it contends with more... by 0xB31B1B on Sunday July 28, 2019 @12:57PM (#20548517)
The Acela corridor in the north east US connects DC, Philly, NYC, and Boston. Many trains run per day and most of them are full capacity. The Acela corridor revenues support the entire other ~Amtrak routes. Most cities along the Acela have sufficient public transit and density to not require car rentals on arrival.
Re:BART slows rollout of new trains as it contends with more... by bobthepanda on Sunday July 28, 2019 @01:00PM (#20548538)
Funnily enough, the Midwest is pretty much a spoke and hub of medium sized metro areas focused around Chicago.

There’s the Northeast corridor (and its cousin the Southeast corridor going down to Atlanta).

The PNW cities also are clustered like this but have difficult geography.

California and the Central Valley with the Bay and LA also meet this criteria, but CAHSR is run by a mix of incompetents and constrained by the wording of the ballot initiative that got it approved.

Re:BART slows rollout of new trains as it contends with more... by craftyguy on Sunday July 28, 2019 @04:01PM (#20549520)
> The PNW cities also are clustered like this but have difficult geography.

Not really. It's pretty flat here in the Willamette valley, where the majority of Oregon's population lives, and relatively flat going north into Washington to Seattle... But the best we've got for long distance trains is Amtrak which shares the tracks with commercial traffic, where Amtrak gets basically the lowest priority on the tracks.

Re:BART slows rollout of new trains as it contends with more... by craftyguy on Sunday July 28, 2019 @04:03PM (#20549529)
I think their point is that one city (SF, not the entire US) took 20 years to get trains that Sweden had throughout their country 20 years ago. Their comparison is actually worse for the US than comparing the entire US train system (ha) to Sweden. That's really sad.
Re:BART slows rollout of new trains as it contends with more... by BurningFrog on Sunday July 28, 2019 @05:11PM (#20549859)
My impression is that OP is comparing the Stockholm subway to Bart.

Comparing long distance train service to Bart would be weird.

Re:BART slows rollout of new trains as it contends with more... by wbl on Sunday July 28, 2019 @10:14AM (#20547638)
We're talking about one of the richest parts of the US.
Re:BART slows rollout of new trains as it contends with more... by BurningFrog on Sunday July 28, 2019 @01:08PM (#20548586)
We're also talking about Ground Zero of the BANANA movement.

BANANA: Build Absolutely Nothing Anywhere Near Anyone

Re:BART slows rollout of new trains as it contends with more... by khuey on Sunday July 28, 2019 @11:11AM (#20547938)
The Bay Area is one of the richest parts of the US on paper sure but much of that wealth comes from absurdly inflated land valuations that are taxed at very low rates.
Re:BART slows rollout of new trains as it contends with more... by strken on Sunday July 28, 2019 @12:08PM (#20548210)
The impression I get from the US is that inter-city passenger rail is usually an afterthought tacked onto a massive freight network. You travel the same speed as whatever cargo is being transported, never mind that it takes longer and costs more than an equivalent bus route.
Re:BART slows rollout of new trains as it contends with more... by kpU8efre7r on Sunday July 28, 2019 @06:36PM (#20550203)
Does the U.S. have the curse of being first? Europe got to largely rebuild their rail from scratch after WWII whereas U.S. rail has been where it is for a very long time.
Re:BART slows rollout of new trains as it contends with more... by qarlow on Sunday July 28, 2019 @12:53PM (#20548484)
> Now finally these new BART trains rolling out, some NYC trains were also modernizing some about a decade ago, but I haven't been to Sweden or much of the rest of Europe in a long time, and I wonder how much further they've progressed.

Unfortunately very little in Sweden. Really the only thing of note close to Sweden would probably be the subway in Copenhagen. Maybe Spain would be impressive, but most of it is happening in Asia these days.