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Re:Robinhood Stored Passwords in Plaintext by mikeash on Wednesday July 24, 2019 @08:26PM (#20521526)
Maybe we should avoid sending passwords altogether. With some client-aide code, you could build a challenge-response system that eliminates this risk entirely.
Re:Robinhood Stored Passwords in Plaintext by Someone1234 on Wednesday July 24, 2019 @08:37PM (#20521585)
It is possible. But much easier to get wrong than to get right.

Specifically if you hash the password client side then the hash fundamentally becomes the password, and having that sit plaintext in logs is identical to the pre-hash password since both can re-played to authenticate.

I believe this is still a respected/secure version of what you describe:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secure_Remote_Password_protoco...

Re:Robinhood Stored Passwords in Plaintext by gpm on Wednesday July 24, 2019 @09:49PM (#20521930)
No, having a client side hashed password sit in your logs is way better because it only introduces risk for your own service, instead of risk for every user who reuses their password on multiple services. It changes a compromise log from a widespread identify theft risk to a contained privilege escalation risk.

(Provided either you, or all the other services using this scheme, are sensible enough to salt with a string unique to their website such as a domain name)

Re:Robinhood Stored Passwords in Plaintext by Hello71 on Wednesday July 24, 2019 @09:49PM (#20521934)
just "hashing the password" is not a "challenge-response" protocol.
Re:Robinhood Stored Passwords in Plaintext by cyc115 on Thursday July 25, 2019 @01:24AM (#20522782)
Thank you
Re:Robinhood Stored Passwords in Plaintext by snazz on Wednesday July 24, 2019 @08:33PM (#20521565)
Has there been any research into this or any companies that use it yet?
Re:Robinhood Stored Passwords in Plaintext by tsukikage on Thursday July 25, 2019 @03:25AM (#20523387)
There's this thing: https://trykno.com/

As they're incredibly opaque about what they're doing, it's hard to tell whether they're part of the "get it wrong" crowd, but being incredibly opaque about what they're doing doesn't bode well.

Re:Robinhood Stored Passwords in Plaintext by ifdefdebug on Thursday July 25, 2019 @05:30AM (#20523915)
I used this when I was doing web apps for small enterprises in early 2000's - I sent a random string in a hidden input in the login form and had some javascript concatenate the password and the random string and send me back the username, the random string and the hash of the concatenated string. I hope I got that right (not doing web apps any more since a long time ...).
Re:Robinhood Stored Passwords in Plaintext by MrStonedOne on Thursday July 25, 2019 @06:44AM (#20524250)
You would want to use a token and the string and only accept the token to look up the string that you would only accept once and for a limited time.

Otherwise its vulnerable to replay attacks

Re:Robinhood Stored Passwords in Plaintext by ifdefdebug on Thursday July 25, 2019 @10:02AM (#20525410)
Yes I think I was cashing the generated string server side for a while and checking if the string I received back had a matching entry in the cache, otherwise reject it.

Anyway, it's been a long time ago, and if I had to do it again today, i would rather not roll my own.

Re:Robinhood Stored Passwords in Plaintext by cyc115 on Thursday July 25, 2019 @01:25AM (#20522790)
Fido (and now w3c)'s WebAuthn come to mind
Re:Robinhood Stored Passwords in Plaintext by lonelappde on Thursday July 25, 2019 @12:12AM (#20522492)
Chip-and-pin credit cards use it. 2FA/Fido/Yubikey use it.
Re:Robinhood Stored Passwords in Plaintext by willsr on Wednesday July 24, 2019 @09:02PM (#20521715)
Amazon use it in their Cognito offering.
Re:Robinhood Stored Passwords in Plaintext by bilekas on Thursday July 25, 2019 @06:20AM (#20524156)
if you can encrypt from the client side, you're always going to be able to reverse it too, its like storing the md5 of my plaintext password, just because it doesnt LOOK like my password in plaintext, it pretty much still is