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Re:Cars took over because the legal system helped squeezed o... by majewsky on Wednesday July 10, 2019 @05:21AM (#20400379)
As a rough estimate, a streetcar line is more efficient than a bus line above 40,000 passengers per day. My city (Dresden, Germany) has a bus line with 70,000 passengers per day, and you can really see it cracking at the seams. During rush hour, busses run every 3 minutes, and that interval cannot be increased any further because the busses would start blocking each other, thus backing up from the bus stop into the road and creating additional congestion.

The only thing the city can do (and that's what they're working on) is to upgrade from bus to streetcar. Dresden has some of the longest trams in the world, at 45 meters (50 yards), and these carry 3-4 bus loads at once.

Re:Cars took over because the legal system helped squeezed o... by sokoloff on Wednesday July 10, 2019 @06:31AM (#20400668)
The German bus systems I’ve used have been night and day better than US ones. Buses that mostly run to a schedule are incomprehensible to most in the US.

Probably related, I doubt we have a bus line with anywhere near that ridership.

Re:Cars took over because the legal system helped squeezed o... by 205guy on Wednesday July 10, 2019 @05:37PM (#20406843)
SF has the notorious 38 Geary that had 55+K daily ridership (boardings) in 2017 [1]. It has many of the problems of an overloaded bus line (traffic causing buses to run together, etc). Oddly, the SF Muni metro lines (what they call the light rail, runs underground downtown but on the street elsewhere) don't seem as congested, but I can't find the ridership numbers.

People have been complaining about the 38 for years, but I don't want to criticize the SFMTA (local agency that runs buses/trolley buses and light rail) because it does seem to get the job done without much expensive investment (cost of most recent underground metro in SF was $1.6B for 1.7 miles [2]).

[1] https://sf.curbed.com/2017/9/19/16302396/sf-worst-bus-transi...

[2] https://www.sfmta.com/projects/central-subway-project

Re:Cars took over because the legal system helped squeezed o... by kasey_junk on Wednesday July 10, 2019 @08:46AM (#20401416)
I was curious about this as I’ve never looked into ridership by route and at least for Chicago it is absolutely true. A 70k route would be more than 3x the biggest in Chicago.

https://www.transitchicago.com/assets/1/6/Monthly_Ridership_...

Re:Cars took over because the legal system helped squeezed o... by bryanlarsen on Wednesday July 10, 2019 @10:31AM (#20402291)
At least the red, blue & pink lines exceed 70k/weekday. Which is the point: anything approaching that level should be converted from bus to rail.
Re:Cars took over because the legal system helped squeezed o... by majewsky on Wednesday July 10, 2019 @08:48AM (#20401430)
To be fair, that 70k route is one of the top 5 routes in Europe by passenger numbers IIRC.