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Re:macOS Catalina, 64-bit, 32-bit, and related Questions by rock_artist on Saturday June 22, 2019 @02:33PM (#20251002)
If you have no use for 32-bit than you shouldn't care... For modern software or many fields, 32bit isn't critical.

However, Some fields still have some 32-bit based products (or frameworks) which would break on Catalina.

Why would someone use 32bit? There are closed-sourced products that never released as 64bit. for software developers that's quite rate but still for some fields there are no real alternatives for those products. so they should keep older versions or run VM.

Re:macOS Catalina, 64-bit, 32-bit, and related Questions by reaperducer on Saturday June 22, 2019 @03:12PM (#20251179)
There are closed-sourced products that never released as 64bit

Yep. I have a number of 32-bit programs that were never and will never be ported to 64 bits because the author has died, the company is out of business, or other reasons.

Now I will have to buy replacements for these programs just so I can run an OS that gets the latest security updates.

It can also affect hardware.

For example, I have two Apple AirMac routers that can only be configured with a version of Airport Utility that runs on old hardware. I'm lucky to have an old iLamp around that I can use when this is necessary, but when that dies, I have to throw away two perfectly good routers just because Apple chooses not to support them in the current version of Airport Utility.

[dead]
Re:macOS Catalina, 64-bit, 32-bit, and related Questions by ken on Saturday June 22, 2019 @04:14PM (#20251508)
AirMac is Apple’s actual name for their wireless routers and cards, in some markets.
Re:macOS Catalina, 64-bit, 32-bit, and related Questions by reaperducer on Saturday June 22, 2019 @05:01PM (#20251713)
Is it really so hard to use actual names of things so people know what the fuck you’re talking about?

AirMac is their actual names. Just because you don't know about something doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

As for iLamp, that was a fairly common name for that computer when it was popular. If you don't know it, you should turn in your nerd card.

Re:macOS Catalina, 64-bit, 32-bit, and related Questions by scarface74 on Saturday June 22, 2019 @06:05PM (#20251961)
In all fairness. How many non Mac folks or even Mac folks that don’t listen to ATP would know colloquial terms like the “MacBook One” and the “MacBook Escape”?

The G4 iMac was discontinued in 2004 - over 15 years ago. I’m very much an Apple nerd but I haven’t heard it call that before today.

Re:macOS Catalina, 64-bit, 32-bit, and related Questions by DonHopkins on Saturday June 22, 2019 @08:27PM (#20252514)
I too have been using Apple computers since the Apple ][, and I never heard of iLamp, either.

iVory, definitely: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Symbolics#Ivory_and_Open_Gener...

iRack, of course: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rw2nkoGLhrE

iBrator, naturally: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EExgxtJjRS8

iSmell, unfortunately: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISmell

But iLamp? Nope.

Where can I turn in my nerd card?

Re:macOS Catalina, 64-bit, 32-bit, and related Questions by rangibaby on Saturday June 22, 2019 @08:50PM (#20252591)
It’s the iMac that looks like a lamp. I think G4?
Re:macOS Catalina, 64-bit, 32-bit, and related Questions by macintux on Saturday June 22, 2019 @07:55PM (#20252408)
I used my first Apple computer about 40 years ago. I’ve been conversant with, or a fan of, the company for decades. I don’t happen to recall “iLamp”.
Re:macOS Catalina, 64-bit, 32-bit, and related Questions by scarface74 on Saturday June 22, 2019 @04:20PM (#20251531)
Just from Googling...

https://support.apple.com/ja-jp/airmac

It does look like that’s the actual name in some markets - at least the AirMac.

Re:macOS Catalina, 64-bit, 32-bit, and related Questions by simongr3dal on Saturday June 22, 2019 @02:49PM (#20251074)
If the hardware, the operating systems, and the software ecosystem around these products kept on supporting 32-bit the products never had any critical incetive to transition.

Perhpas now they will have that, or other pieces of software will come and fill the void.

I'm still pretty bummed about what this will mean for WINE though, it will mean a lot more work for those devs – or a serious reduction in the amount of software that will work with it.

Re:macOS Catalina, 64-bit, 32-bit, and related Questions by bangonkeyboard on Saturday June 22, 2019 @03:25PM (#20251237)
This idea that vendors should seek to actively break working software simply because it's "old" is repellent to me. I use several 32-bit apps and components regularly because they continue to function better than the alternatives. Many are unlikely to ever be rewritten or replaced because the developers, ecosystems, and business models that made them possible are today either gone or moribund.
Re:macOS Catalina, 64-bit, 32-bit, and related Questions by Bahamut on Saturday June 22, 2019 @03:54PM (#20251409)
And this is how we end up with long lifetimes for software like Internet Explorer, which ends up holding back most people's experience with the web, especially mobile, because a lot of extra scripts/code has to be shipped to maintain compatibility (polyfills, newer features can't be used and thus must be compiled around, etc.), which directly impacts the value being able to be delivered to end users costing more or having less time being able to be allocated to doing so.

More people have to suffer usually if software ends up long lived without being pushed to upgrade when there are newer technologies that improve the experience - it's a heavy price of others you're asking for a lot of times when choices have to be made between compatibility and improvements that often get discounted unreasonably.

Re:macOS Catalina, 64-bit, 32-bit, and related Questions by bangonkeyboard on Saturday June 22, 2019 @04:14PM (#20251507)
> More people have to suffer usually if software ends up long lived without being pushed to upgrade when there are newer technologies that improve the experience - it's a heavy price of others you're asking for a lot of times when choices have to be made between compatibility and improvements that often get discounted unreasonably.

I look at all of the Mac software I've lost and will lose to upgrades over the years, including the offline-only parts of my workflow that held back only myself, and weigh them against this bright new future of low-effort blown-up tablet apps on my desktop that they were sacrificed for. A heavy price certainly has been paid here.

Re:macOS Catalina, 64-bit, 32-bit, and related Questions by alacombe on Saturday June 22, 2019 @07:25PM (#20252298)
Just think of all the software infrastructure you rely on is probably running COBOL or very, very old tech, you really don't want those to be re-written today. Also, the industry (think CNC controllers) relies on tried and true interfaces that are just unavailable today (USB is utter rubbish in high electrical noise environment) and there is barely replacement either. Not to mention the cost of training blue-collars operators...

Real world is not the web cocoon, even there, switching front-end every 2 years is not acceptable.

disclamer: I know that for a fact as I'm in the process of replacing a CNC control system with modern parts, trust me it's HARD.

Re:macOS Catalina, 64-bit, 32-bit, and related Questions by erik_seaberg on Saturday June 22, 2019 @09:45PM (#20252777)
If only IE can render a web page, that's not a problem only because IE got old, it was always a problem with bad work on that page, and people were rightly complaining back when it happened.

It's crazy that we can't run old software on vastly more powerful hardware. Imagine if we suddenly couldn't read old books.

Re:macOS Catalina, 64-bit, 32-bit, and related Questions by simongr3dal on Sunday June 23, 2019 @08:14AM (#20254977)
I don't believe that people are actively breaking software. It is simply a side-effect of how progress happens in this industry.

Computers are made up of many small parts the same with software, every component comes from different vendors and they are all working asynchrously to each other and adjusting to the changes around them every time they update or make a new component.

Each new change looks like a tiny leap-frogging, but if you don't update or rearchitechture for a long while it becomes an insurmountable to task to update because the whole world has moved away from under you. Not by monumental breaking changes but by thousands small changes that has added up.

Re:macOS Catalina, 64-bit, 32-bit, and related Questions by rock_artist on Saturday June 22, 2019 @03:15PM (#20251192)
> I'm still pretty bummed about what this will mean for WINE though

why? all Intel chips currently supports 32bit ISA. You can still have VMs to run 32bit. also IIRC, Wine is X-Window? so you can even attach through SSH-X to it with simple Docker container.

Re:macOS Catalina, 64-bit, 32-bit, and related Questions by qwerty456127 on Saturday June 22, 2019 @03:57PM (#20251425)
> Wine is X-Window? so you can even attach through SSH-X to it

Absolutely true. I once had to set a client-server Windows-based CRM in a small company. The server had a native Linux version, the client app was windows-only. Client machines ran Windows. Users also wanted to work from home. For some reason (some kind of connection glitches or whatever, I can't remember already) I've chosen to install Xfree on the Ubuntu server (one of command-line-managed VirtualBox VMs on another Ubuntu server actually), set-up the app for direct client-server connection, let users connect to the Linux box over OpenVPN and run the Win32 app with Wine over SSH on their Windows machines :-)

I've fell in love with the X as I have managed to set this up (quite easily, BTW). I certainly don't want Linux to loose such a beautiful ability as it switches to Wayland (I don't worry much about Wine though, all the distributions but Ubuntu keep shipping multiarch libs and it works just fine but I won't update my Mac as it has just 128 GiBs SSD and I have no disk space to spare for a Windows VM).