E Programming Language

Re:E Programming Language by blackflame7000 on Wednesday May 22, 2019 @05:55PM (#19985975)

Could someone explain the difference between a programming language and a framework? I’m confused how a programming language can be implemented in java or lisp. Doesn’t that just make it a java/lisp framework?

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Re:E Programming Language by feanaro on Wednesday May 22, 2019 @06:07PM (#19986074)

A framework is usually just a library for language L. Often it's extensive and serves a single broadly-defined purpose.

A programming language implementation for a language P, written in language L, usually denotes a function in L which maps strings representing programs in P to effects (interpreters) or to programs in yet another language (compilers).

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Re:E Programming Language by abecedarius on Wednesday May 22, 2019 @06:31PM (#19986259)

E was never meant to be tied to Java (after the very early period in both languages when the E people tried to get Sun interested in incorporating their ideas). http://erights.org/history/original-e/index.html

After that the JVM was the first target platform but the language design was not meant to depend on it.

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Re:E Programming Language by mhh__ on Wednesday May 22, 2019 @06:08PM (#19986084)

Programming languages have to be implemented in something.

It is traditional to implement the language in something quick, and then start compiling/interpreting the language in itself as soon as possible (Now you have a very big test suite for free)

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Re:E Programming Language by blackflame7000 on Thursday May 23, 2019 @08:06PM (#19997253)

I see, so it uses a java interpreter but the syntax of the language is not java?

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Re:E Programming Language by voldacar on Wednesday May 22, 2019 @05:58PM (#19986005)

By that logic, every programming language is just an assembly framework ;)

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Re:E Programming Language by agravier on Wednesday May 22, 2019 @07:10PM (#19986611)

That sounds truthy. Every programming language is a machine language framework.

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Re:E Programming Language by blackflame7000 on Thursday May 23, 2019 @08:04PM (#19997243)

Not necessarily, I would consider an interpreter as something entirely different because there is no requirement that it abide to the syntax of the language. I feel that syntax defines the language just like spoken language. It doesn’t make sense to me to say this language english is implemented in Spanish and German.

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Re:E Programming Language by boomlinde on Friday May 24, 2019 @10:45AM (#20002064)

> Not necessarily, I would consider an interpreter as something entirely different because there is no requirement that it abide to the syntax of the language.

What does this mean? A language interpreter naturally abides to the syntax of the language it implements.

> It doesn’t make sense to me to say this language english is implemented in Spanish and German.

Maybe because natural languages are a useless analogy for this in the first place.

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Re:E Programming Language by voldacar on Friday May 24, 2019 @11:32AM (#20002599)

a cpu is a microcode interpreter

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Re:E Programming Language by timClicks on Wednesday May 22, 2019 @09:52PM (#19987590)

Well, a CPU microcode framework. Or perhaps an electron mustering framework.

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Re:E Programming Language by ketralnis on Wednesday May 22, 2019 @06:22PM (#19986185)

Java's implemented largely in C++. Does that make Java just a C++ framework?

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Re:E Programming Language by pjmlp on Thursday May 23, 2019 @05:46AM (#19990113)

What Java implementation?

OpenJDK is a mix of Java and C++, with long term roadmap to replace more and more with Java, also known as Project Metropolis.

IBM J9 is a mix of C++ and Java.

JikesRVM is bootstraped in Java.

Then there are PTC, Aicas, Websphere RealTime, J/Rockit, Azul (with LLVM integration), GraalVM (mostly Java), Ricoh JVM, Cisco JVM, Gemalto,...

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Re:E Programming Language by coldacid on Wednesday May 22, 2019 @08:45PM (#19987221)

I'm pretty sure it's largely classic C, /not/ C++.

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Re:E Programming Language by ketralnis on Wednesday May 22, 2019 @09:33PM (#19987496)

I'm pretty sure that's 100% immaterial to the argument but from 8 seconds on Google, here: https://github.com/openjdk/jdk C++: 13.9% C: 5.4%

Or here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HotSpot "Written in C++, Assembly"

Or here: https://blogs.oracle.com/sundararajan/so-you-want-to-read-ho...

I should have said Perl to really bring out the pedants.

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Re:E Programming Language by pjmlp on Thursday May 23, 2019 @05:47AM (#19990119)

13.9% is hardly a big surface and I bet those C values come from C++ header files.

Also OpenJDK is just one implementation among several.

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Re:E Programming Language by abecedarius on Wednesday May 22, 2019 @08:48PM (#19987235)

It was C++ at least in the 90s when I interviewed for the JVM compiler team.

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Re:E Programming Language by nickpsecurity on Wednesday May 22, 2019 @09:22PM (#19987440)

https://stackoverflow.com/questions/10028057/what-programmin...

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