It just died off since then, since 1. nobody really quits reddit, and 2. the aforementioned events made voat culture, well, not great.
Do you think the group of people you called cesspool will just accept that ? In their perspective by banning them, they are the one being oppressed. Of course they are going to fight back and try to create/move to alternative platform.
> Gas the kikes Race War Now is not an illegal threat. The supreme court has ruled that a threat needs a place and a time to be considered actionable or illegal. example: We're gassing the kikes at the Freemont Synagogue on 5th avenue, Tuesday.
This is the most upvoted comment. We can say things like "it's a matter of perspective", but sometimes things are simply objectively shit.
edit, to those of you who think I'm exaggerating, here is one comment in that thread out of many:
"Fucking faggots...meanwhile Antifa gets run of every liberal city in the country while the nigs murder us daily...and we aren't even allowed to talk about clownworld."
Pretty much any place on the internet that promotes itself solely on being a "free speech zone/place" is trash. Theoretically they should be fine but in practice they just always attract assholes and people who want to say very edgy things. Someone should coin it, "the law of internet free speech zones" or something.
It has nothing to do with agreeing or disagreeing. Proper places of discussion don't have comments like "gas the kikes isn't technically hate speech so we should be allowed to say it here". You can always go ahead and host such a place if you want, but I'll stick to HN, Tildes, and Reddit instead so I can have reasonable discussion.
> Pretty much any place on the internet that promotes itself solely on being a "free speech zone/place" is trash.
Twitter is equally trash and has plenty of Anti-White, Anti-Jew (mostly in Arabic but nobody talks about it) and Anti-Men rhetoric, Violent threats towards Children and people get a free pass because they have a blue checkmark by their name and the "right" politics.
Also the term Hate speech is an ill defined term, which is used when convenient if someone has the wrong politics (e.g. centre-right, libertarian, conservative or religious). The terms is soo badly defined in law that people in the UK are going to prison for posting offensive rap lyrics on facebook.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-43816921
> Proper places of discussion don't have comments like "gas the kikes isn't technically hate speech so we should be allowed to say it here".
Absolute garbage. This is snobbery and nothing more. I would argue that by just siloing people on the internet it is actually making discussion in general more problematic. In the past, we used IRC, AOL chat room and other things with no moderation. If someone was just being rude all the time, people just ended up ignoring them and they left ... I miss the old internet.
There are subjective things and there are objective things. What you're doing at this moment (trying to justify both sides) is intellectually dishonest.
> To them you are the assholes for calling it trash or wanting to get rid of it.
A child might call their parents stupid for not letting them eat candy all day. Objectively the parents are not stupid, the child has a mistaken perspective.
From the perspective of a hypergiant star, the sun is not that big. This does not change the objective truth that the sun is a large object.
I hope you realize you are justifying horrible, vile speech by trying to "see both sides".
> There are subjective things and there are objective things. What you're doing at this moment (trying to justify both sides) is intellectually dishonest.
Well you didn't really justify anything or understand what I said and then accused me of acting in bad faith. Lovely.
> A child might call their parents stupid for not letting them eat candy all day. Objectively the parents are not stupid, the child has a mistaken perspective.
Also the nanny state that you are promoting will have the opposite effect of what you want. Most of the places that have draconian rules are normally the places where most of the vice occurs ... it just happens out of sight of the authorities.
> I hope you realize you are justifying horrible, vile speech by trying to "see both sides".
I believe in freedom of speech. If people cannot say vile things they cannot be corrected by the rest of society, by silencing them you will just force it underground where it will fester. Well done you are making the problem worse.
In the prespective of the child, the parent might be stupid. Even in the perspective of other parent, some parent might not consider it stupid.
This just show "large" is relative.
I'm not justifying horrible, vile speech because I disagree that the speech is horrible or vile.
I'd feel better if we lived in a society where we wouldn't have to lead this discussion in the first place but since that's just not the case education and limiting propaganda seems like a good way to go.
Its boil down to whoever win on the battle.
The winning side get to decide the meaning of free speech, the meaning of radicals, right or wrong or where the line is.
Yes, society as a whole has a collective opinion that forms the mainstream and defines a) what's outside of that and b) what to do with those outside of it. Do you see a problem in excluding these opinions from mainstream platforms like Facebook and reddit? Even with a pretty open stance towards free speech I see excluding people posting racist death threats from a platform I use to look at cat pictures as a positive.
It's almost a Poe's Law of moral relativism in general, but there's the additional step of "and therefore, I will not have opinions on right and wrong and will let others do as they please, because who am I to have moral opinions about others"—but that in itself is a moral opinion about others.
The Overton window (which is what you are referring to) changes over time. What is considered acceptable is transient (I've seen the term for ethinic minority change 5 times in my life time so far and the older terms are now considered racist). Homosexuality for example would have been outside of the Overton window in the past and would have been deemed outside of polite discussion.
People have lost their jobs or banned for comments on Facebook / Twitter etc that are literally years old. Most of these comments were made made over a decade ago.
There are many groups of people that conduct a witch hunter using "outrage archaeology". They will go through someone's tweets for something that is now considered inappropriate and they will demand an apology for things that were said decades before and the person probably doesn't even remember why they made that comment at the time. Bernie Sanders (who is considered from my understanding to be somewhat of a progressive candidate) had something he wrote in 1980 dredged up in an attempt to smear him.
I've was temporarily suspended on twitter because I posted a Death Threat to my friend as a Joke between us and some other friends that were following each other. My friend and I regularly trade racist remarks about each others race on whatsapp because it is a long standing joke. Should we be censored because of an inside joke between friends?
I see moderating who can participate in a group as part of the opinion that this thread seems to try and uphold. If reddit (as the more or less democratic whole, not the company or technical system) prefers not to give terrorists, white supremacists or whatever fringe group that is based on hatred a platform you're free to see that as a problem, it's just not one the mainstream agrees with.
Likewise, the "extremist" too have their viewpoint, to them you are the danger, and they too will fight for it.
If you don't allow them to be part of the world you end up alienating them forever and they can never redeem themselves and change.
Society has forgotten how to forgive.
Easily: what is right improves the human condition and reduces suffering. What is wrong does the opposite.
Let me short-circuit your next question, which is surely "how do you measure what improves the human condition, and what is suffering?" We have to use our judgment, which we are graced with by virtue of being moral agents. This is subjective, like anything worth doing, which means we sometimes get it wrong. And that's fine. The fact that we sometimes imprison innocent people doesn't invalidate wholesale the concept of a system of justice.
Before you judge something as morally right or wrong, you have to have a standard that you're judging it by. Otherwise you'll just end up making ad-hoc decisions that depend on your emotions at the moment with no particular meaning or direction. Your morals will wander aimlessly in the space of possible morals, pushed this way and that by peer pressure and the media. They'll also develop internal inconsistencies. What's the use of an aimless moral? You might as well just pick them randomly.
The owners posted last week a message telling some of their users to stop inciting violence as the Feds were in contact. Given that Voat is ultra-toxic now it's not going to be possible to moderate every piece of content ever posted.
Just read that thread and it's crazy how much it has festered since then. Everyone there just seems so angry all the time, there are zero positive posts on the front page. How do people live their lives so angry all the time?
The groups are:
1. Groups that were kicked off Reddit for hate or questionable sex, went to voat, and got shut down there, too, or are still there but get very little activity.
An example of one that got shut down would be /v/jailbait.
An example of one that just gets very little activity would be /v/coontown. It goes months between posts.
2. Questionable sex groups that are somewhat active. /v/loli is an example.
3. Groups on neutral topics that get regular posts, like /v/technology or /v/funny or /v/science.
4. Hate groups with regular posts. (I assume these exist. I've never actually seen one, because I only go to voat when some disucssion elsewhere points to it, and that has never taken me to an active hate group).
The two kinds of people are:
1. People who came there for the hate groups.
2. People who came there for the sex groups.
The people who came there for the hate groups also post in the neutral groups, so the comments in /v/technology or /v/funny are full of hate stuff. The hate people seem to stay out of the sex groups.
I can't tell if the sex people also post in the neutral groups. My guess is that they probably do not.
The Voat groups for things like science and technology have nothing that sets them apart from the corresponding Reddit groups except the hate comments.
Sex is much easier to compartmentalize than hate. If you like something that most would find unacceptable sexually, there is no reason for that to come up when you participate in, say, a technology or science discussion. You can go to Voat for those sex groups that aren't allowed on Reddit, but stay on Reddit for everything else.
Hate group people, on the other hand, are more likely to let it leak out, and so get banned from neutral topic Reddit groups, and so have to go somewhere like Voat for those topics.
Voat is very small luckily, that may be the reason why you're hearing so few of it. If you visit the frontpage, it's full of jewish conspiracies and "gas the jews", as expected.
If the net effect is that certain people left Reddit for a platform inviting the worst of Reddit, and then didn't stay there either, that seems like a win.