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Re:Tesla Posts Big Quarterly Loss as Its Electric-Car Sales Lag by sliken on Thursday April 25, 2019 @01:27AM (#19745284)
Agreed. Seems like Tesla may have misjudged the model 3 demand and should have increased the number of production lines more slowly. I think in Fremont factory has 6 lines. One for X, one for S, and 4 for the model 3. Seems like they should just move one or two of the lines from model 3 to the model Y, which shares 75% of the same parts instead of committing to building several new lines in Reno and China.

While the model 3 may be luxury, it looks crazy cheap compared to the electric Audi, Volvo, BMW, and Porsche competitors... doubly so if you consider range. The model 3 even looks pretty good on a cost to own basis compared to non-luxury cars like the Toyota Camry or Honda accord.

The cheapest Tesla (around $40k these days), isn't too far off the average cost of a new car ($34,000) and most will save easily $6k in maintenance and gas over the life of the car. I suspect most would consider the model 3 interior too spartan and plasticy to be consider luxury.

Re:Tesla Posts Big Quarterly Loss as Its Electric-Car Sales Lag by novaRom on Thursday April 25, 2019 @04:59AM (#19746261)
>> While the model 3 may be luxury, it looks crazy cheap compared to the electric Audi, Volvo, BMW, and Porsche competitors...

I tried Tesla test drive and one thing I don't like is how cheap it feels inside. Low quality materials. So you cannot compare just their prices without mentioning materials and build quality.

Re:Tesla Posts Big Quarterly Loss as Its Electric-Car Sales Lag by sliken on Thursday April 25, 2019 @05:26AM (#19746383)
I rented a Tesla S (75d I believe) for 3 days. Felt pretty awesome, and stomping on the accelerator put a smile on my face every time. The nav system was a pleasure, actually better than Google Nav on a top of the line phone. The voice recognition for nav and music playing worked really well.

I've used similar nav systems from BMW, Subaru, and Toyota and they seemed like lame software running on a 5-10 year old phone. Poor touch screens, smaller screens, poor voice recognition, and poor nav. I'd rather they just have an aux port for music and let me hang my own tablet on the dash somewhere.

Overall fit/finish for the model S was not as nice as an Audi I've been in, but was plenty good for me.

The model 3 is of course substantially less luxurious. Single smaller display instead of two displays. Many less buttons/switches. I've only done a test drive in the 3. But I do have several friends that have switches from S to 3, or 3 to S, and they speak very highly of the 3. No doubt the 3 is built to a much lower price point, and you can tell. I think part of the Tesla plan is to have you touch nothing but the steering wheel or the display. I suspect the voice commands will get better over time, they already handle nav and music well.

But when it comes down to it, I'd pick performance, handling, and range over more expensive interior.

Not like Audi, Volvo, or BMW is selling anything close to the model 3 price and range. I drove a Chevy Volt (comparable on price, but not so much on range or performance) and it was nowhere close to the model 3.

Who is willing to buy a slower car and pay 50% more for 2/3rds the range just to get a nicer interior? Not me.

Re:Tesla Posts Big Quarterly Loss as Its Electric-Car Sales Lag by neuronic on Thursday April 25, 2019 @05:34AM (#19746418)
> I've used similar nav systems from BMW, Subaru, and Toyota and they seemed like lame software running on a 5-10 year old phone. Poor touch screens, smaller screens, poor voice recognition, and poor nav. I'd rather they just have an aux port for music and let me hang my own tablet on the dash somewhere.

Thought the same, but the newest Volkswagen generation has improved a lot. Their touch screens and software feel much much more usable than even 2 years ago.

Re:Tesla Posts Big Quarterly Loss as Its Electric-Car Sales Lag by sliken on Thursday April 25, 2019 @05:52AM (#19746492)
Comparable to google Nav on a new iphone or pixel 3? If so, I'll definitely have to keep an eye on the future VW electric cars.
Re:Tesla Posts Big Quarterly Loss as Its Electric-Car Sales Lag by neuronic on Thursday April 25, 2019 @10:29AM (#19748503)
No, definitely not but they have still made leaps from previous iterations. And I think that's a very positive development.

My subjective impression is it basically went from major annoyance to "quite usable". I recently used it on a trip from Northern Germany to Amsterdam and it worked really well.

Re:Tesla Posts Big Quarterly Loss as Its Electric-Car Sales Lag by dannyw on Thursday April 25, 2019 @05:04AM (#19746291)
People expected $35k before incentives. That means an out of pocket cost of approx $28k.

People did not expect $36k. $28k vs $36k is HUGE.

Re:Tesla Posts Big Quarterly Loss as Its Electric-Car Sales Lag by sliken on Thursday April 25, 2019 @05:37AM (#19746428)
Agreed, it is huge. Potential market at $36k vs $28k is quite a bit smaller. At least Tesla bundled in autopilot at zero extra cost.

It's not as good as originally promised, but still a pretty good deal in my opinion. Just depends how much people are willing to spend for good acceleration, avoiding trips to gas stations, and avoiding spending $1000-$1200 of gas per year. Of course electricity is not free either. My last fill up in California was $3.99 a gallon and I spent $51. I do that about 4-5 times a month.

Re:Tesla Posts Big Quarterly Loss as Its Electric-Car Sales Lag by taneq on Thursday April 25, 2019 @06:01AM (#19746534)
> At least Tesla bundled in autopilot at zero extra cost.

For about 15 minutes, before they rolled that back.

Honestly that's the biggest red flag, to me - the chaotic mix of announcements, retractions, chops and changes to their pricing and marketing strategy. As an outsider it feels like the company has cool tech but lacks adult supervision.

Re:Tesla Posts Big Quarterly Loss as Its Electric-Car Sales Lag by sliken on Thursday April 25, 2019 @06:33AM (#19746676)
Er, what? Go to https://www.tesla.com/model3, click on buy, next, next. You should see: "Autopilot Included". The car costs $39,500.
Re:Tesla Posts Big Quarterly Loss as Its Electric-Car Sales Lag by sbov on Thursday April 25, 2019 @06:51AM (#19746779)
You have to call in to get the actual base model - they removed the option to order it from the website.
Re:Tesla Posts Big Quarterly Loss as Its Electric-Car Sales Lag by sliken on Thursday April 25, 2019 @07:02AM (#19746837)
Yes, I ignored that one. The $39,500 model with autopilot is right on the website. It's not the promised $35k model, but it does include autopilot.
Re:Tesla Posts Big Quarterly Loss as Its Electric-Car Sales Lag by sbov on Thursday April 25, 2019 @12:06PM (#19749541)
If something is "zero extra cost" I would expect the base model to have it.

Beyond that, what you looked at used to cost $37,500 with autopilot as an optional $3k addon. Now it always includes autopilot but costs $2k more. Again, not exactly "zero extra cost".