Well you don't know why they haven't been able to execute quickly. Maybe that approval they need to start a service wasn't given? Maybe the partnership they needed from the local delivery channel was delayed? Maybe the sellers were restricted to sell only on domestic companies?

JD and TMall have about close to 1,000 distribution points in the major cities with at least 10,000 delivery people each. Same day delivery is standard (order before 10am and it arrives by 6pm) for a lot of products. Install and building furniture at your home is also a common feature. Two day delivery is slow.

Amazon isn't willing to invest the money and for most products on their site they still don't stock products locally. Half the time I find products on their site I have to wait 2/3+ weeks for it to be imported.

There is nothing stopping them having local stock but ... they don't.

I don't think it's logical for them to have local stock. That would require a HUGE capital investment to build up infrastructure and distribution points to go head to head with the locals. I bet Amazon's CFO looks at that and then tells Bezos, "Hey, these numbers are completely irrational, let's spend the money elsewhere where we'll have a better return on investment, please."

Amazon is used to building out localized infrastructure AFTER demand has been proven. In China, local competition already exists and that's why they are getting their asses handed to them. It also seems like Amazon.cn isn't given the leeway they should have been given for local execs to make those kinds of calls. They (Amazon) do a lot right, but that doesn't mean their approach is always right.

It’s been logical to do it in a domestic market to become a market leader but it’s illogical to do it in a new market?

I think there's something to the OP's point.

Amazon's infrastructure roll out paid off in the United States because there was little competition. They rushed out infrastructure and cornered the online shopping and delivery market. Walmart and the other big stores had an entirely different business model and their warehouses and infrastructure took time to adjust and catch up, with Amazon still in the lead.

In China, the local competitors already have a significant head start on their infrastructure, and Amazon would be playing catch up in a relatively unfriendly market. It could take them forever to recoup the investment, if they ever did.

Unfortunately, they can't compete without that infrastructure in place, so what else can they do but leave?

Yeah - and Jeff seems to be the type of guy who is like, you are right CFO. We are here for the short term - let us do what you are saying?!

China is the biggest eComm market in the world! If there was an opportunity for Amazon to penetrate (regulations being the biggest challenge), Amazon would have totally gone for it.

This is a company why, 5 yrs back, committed $5B to India when eComm there was/still is totally burgeoning.

5 yrs ago was 7 yrs after Flipkart cloned Amazon in India by former Amazon employees.

And 5yrs ago was 2yrs after Amazon launched in India. Anyways, Amazon is dominating eComm in India and it seems like the early lead which Flipkart had didn't count for much.

This was already standard in China at least 7 years ago.

I'm curious is this because jd.com is far ahead of American Amazon or because Chinese Amazon is far behind American Amazon?

Having lived in both China and US/Canada, I would say jd and taobao is far ahead of American Amazon. Some key differentiators include delivery speed, UI/UX, product offerings and the ability to chat with merchants instantly.

Amazon has same day delivery and prime now in a lot of the US - I can get the same order before 10 get before 18 from Amazon in my town.

I don't have a ton of experience with UI/UX on JD or TMall, but my experience with alibaba and aliexpress hasn't left me particularly impressed there. But I also have no problem with Amazon's interface and experience in general, which I know lots of people don't like.

Product offerings have never been an issue for me. The overwhelming majority of my online purchases come from Amazon, and the ones that haven't made recently have been pretty niche - handmade Japanese chef knives, limited run board games, manufacturer direct audio equipment...

I can get assembly for furniture, etc., as an add-on for a lot of purchases on amazon, which someone mentioned as a differentiator in another thread.

I can't talk to the merchants instantly, but I don't know that I really want or need to. I rarely have a question for them, and when I have, I generally don't want to get bogged down in a live chat or phone call or whatever, so the email system on Amazon works fine for me.

What you are talking about is a US experience... it's not like that in China from Amazon. They haven't built out locally, and have neglected to acknowledge local competition and invest in local infrastructure properly.

> What you are talking about is a US experience...

Correct.

Because that's what this comment thread is about.

Grandparent: >I'm curious is this because jd.com is far ahead of American Amazon or because Chinese Amazon is far behind American Amazon?

Parent: > I would say jd and taobao is far ahead of American Amazon

The question was whether or not JD and Taobao in China are better than Amazon is in America. Not whether or not Amazon in China is as good as JD and Taobao are in China.