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Re:Trading bots are running wild on cryptocurrency exchanges by momentmaker on Monday April 15, 2019 @05:27PM (#19669083)
How is this any different from algo trading on the stock market?

I read or watched somewhere where the algo traders would skim a tiny percentage of every transaction of mutual funds because they know exactly when to strike.

There are lots of sharks in the muddy water...

Re:Trading bots are running wild on cryptocurrency exchanges by raiyu on Monday April 15, 2019 @05:37PM (#19669154)
Algorithmic trading is about building an algo that determines how a market or stock will move based on news, economy, other factors.

In flash boys the front-running that these quant funds are running isn't about an algorithm, but literally all about having high capacity pipes that can see an order come in and then fill it between different exchanges and based on the minute differences in stock prices pocket the difference.

So an algo fund can lose money if the algorithm is incorrect. While front-running you never lose money.

It's basically like being a tax collector.

Re:Trading bots are running wild on cryptocurrency exchanges by phildaian on Monday April 15, 2019 @05:52PM (#19669251)
Great explanation! For an in depth and relatively formal (and mathematical) look at this from an economist I recommend https://faculty.chicagobooth.edu/eric.budish/research/HFT-Fr...
Re:Trading bots are running wild on cryptocurrency exchanges by afarah on Monday April 15, 2019 @07:21PM (#19669751)
>all about having high capacity pipes that can see an order come in

I don't understand how they can see the order come in. Is this something that only happens in decentralized exchanges?

Re:Trading bots are running wild on cryptocurrency exchanges by aianus on Monday April 15, 2019 @10:40PM (#19670699)
You can pay the NASDAQ (or any exchange) to colocate your server beside their server with a low-latency network link and see a live feed of the orders as they hit the book.
Re:Trading bots are running wild on cryptocurrency exchanges by chii on Tuesday April 16, 2019 @06:19AM (#19672406)
So isn't the problem with the exchange revealing data before it is "committed"? How does one frontrun if the exchange doesn't allow it?
Re:Trading bots are running wild on cryptocurrency exchanges by afarah on Tuesday April 16, 2019 @08:06AM (#19672904)
I know about colocation, but I was under the impression that once you see an order in the book it is in the book. I.e. your order will be placed after it.
Re:Trading bots are running wild on cryptocurrency exchanges by twic on Tuesday April 16, 2019 @02:39PM (#19676136)
If there are multiple exchanges trading the same (or very similar) products, then you might be able to see an order on one, and quickly send an order to the other one. In the US, equities trade on multiple exchanges.
Re:Trading bots are running wild on cryptocurrency exchanges by pbhjpbhj on Monday April 15, 2019 @07:23PM (#19669768)
People paying taxes, in theory at least, get a benefit (to them or society).

Isn't it more like paying off mobsters, or just having someone steal a fraction of a penny from everyone?

Re:Trading bots are running wild on cryptocurrency exchanges by Scoundreller on Monday April 15, 2019 @05:36PM (#19669148)
Anyone can watch crypto going into the exchange. Usually people don’t (shouldn’t?) hold it on the exchange for excessive periods of time, so once it confirms, they try to sell and withdraw.

If you can see this, you can front the sell (before the deposit even confirms) and then be the buyer shortly after it confirms.

But I don’t see this as being much different than providing liquidity and taking the risk that someone else doesn’t want to take.

Re:Trading bots are running wild on cryptocurrency exchanges by dfox on Monday April 15, 2019 @06:38PM (#19669526)
That depends on the underlying cryptocurrency, for example I think that there is no way to design exchange such that BTC deposit would be readily apparent on blockchain before it is credited to the exchange account. So it is simply another argument why "smart contracts" does not solve any useful problem.