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Re:Facebook to ban white nationalist content by kevinh on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @01:21PM (#19503258)
This isn't the first line though–Facebook already bans things like ISIS propaganda. This is in a similar bucket.
Re:Facebook to ban white nationalist content by ThomPete on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @01:26PM (#19503327)
White nationalism isn't even remotely like ISIS propaganda. I am no fan of that ideology for sure but it's actually about something very different than most people think and most people haven't actually spent the time understanding their argument before they form an opinion about it.

Edit: Find it pretty crazy that this can't even be discussed without people accusing me of all sorts of things.

Re:Facebook to ban white nationalist content by pcbro141 on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @01:38PM (#19503518)
These recent white supremacist terrorists like the Christchurch attacker all have the same white nationalist memes and talking points on their social media. The Christchurch terrorist said in his own manifesto the white nationalist memes played a part in his radicalization. The white supremacist groups in their guides admit that the their ironic racist memes are propaganda to get people in their funnel and progressively radicalize them.

I'm glad that after these white supremacist terror attacks and seeing how these attackers all share the same things on social media, more people are waking up and realizing these memes are like ISIS propaganda.

Re:Facebook to ban white nationalist content by Dylan16807 on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @01:37PM (#19503496)
> it's actually about something very different than most people think and most people haven't actually spent the time understanding their argument before they form an opinion about it.

That was facebook's policy as of yesterday.

They changed it for good reason, and it was not a small reason to overcome that much inertia.

Re:Facebook to ban white nationalist content by Macross8299 on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @03:15PM (#19504850)
>White nationalism isn't even remotely like ISIS propaganda.

I don't think so. One wants a caliphate, one wants an ethnostate. The end result is the same for anyone who isn't part of the extremist in-group.

Re:Facebook to ban white nationalist content by otikik on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @02:53PM (#19504569)
One dehumanizes people based on religion and the other dehumanizes people based on skin color. They are both cars, one is blue and the other is yellow.
Re:Facebook to ban white nationalist content by anigbrowl on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @01:34PM (#19503463)
Yeah it is. I'd prefer not to post example content here on HN, but like most political movements ISIS/jihadis and white supremacists have both a public and private position, and the public one may often appear innocuous or reasonable at first appearance, although there are differences in recruiting tactics, eg https://cchs.gwu.edu/sites/g/files/zaxdzs2371/f/downloads/Na...
Re:Facebook to ban white nationalist content by rexpop on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @01:32PM (#19503421)
Stochastic terrorism? It's still a terrorism pipeline.

It's all well and good for you to say "white nationalism is very different from what most people think," but that doesn't stop the OP from being right.

Nationalism of all kinds root from an insecurity, and white nationalism in particular is proppogated in colonial societies to encourage the alienation of brown colonial workers via, among other acts, stochastic terrorism.

It's a lot like ISIS propaganda.

Re:Facebook to ban white nationalist content by elliekelly on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @01:33PM (#19503452)
> it's actually about something very different than most people think

Can you explain what you mean by this?

Re:Facebook to ban white nationalist content by pcbro141 on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @01:42PM (#19503591)
Probably something like:

"We don't encourage people to commit terrorist attacks, we only encourage them to do what it takes to ensure the survival and dominance of the white race."

[dead]
Re:Facebook to ban white nationalist content by anigbrowl on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @03:53PM (#19505248)
it doesn't in it's essence include any form of violent action at least according to ex their US leader

Who would you consider that to be, please?

ISIS ideology is about killing the infidels and actually doing it

I really hope you're not going to offer a 'no true Scotsman' argument for why the people who do commit murders or other terrorism in support of WN ideology should be considered as separate from the people espousing said ideology even though quite a lot of them advocate exactly such action.

'Survival of the white race' suggests there is some looming danger of extinction, a position which seems to have little foundation in fact and mostly depends on the trope that non-white people are rushing to outbreed everyone else - ignoring abundant data showing that high birth rates are correlated with poor mortality outcomes and extreme poverty, and move in inverse proportion to economic security.

I might add that obfuscation and misdirection are key components of far-right recruitment strategies. Refer, for example, to the style guide from the editor of the Daily Stormer, which emphasizes the rhetorical use of humor, irony, and ambiguity to obfuscate the primary agenda while still achieving emotional activation: https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/daily-stormer-nazi-styl...

Re:Facebook to ban white nationalist content by checkyoursudo on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @02:55PM (#19504608)
If the theorists and proponents have such a difficult time separating an ideology from attempts at violent implementation of a program based on that ideology, then perhaps the violence is in fact part of the ideology after all?

If it quacks like a violent duck ...

Re:Facebook to ban white nationalist content by elliekelly on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @04:16PM (#19505545)
I'm still having a hard time understanding the difference. From Wikipedia, as you suggested:

> White nationalists say they seek to ensure the survival of the white race, and the cultures of historically white states. They hold that white people should maintain their majority in majority-white countries, maintain their political and economic dominance, and that their cultures should be foremost. Many white nationalists believe that miscegenation, multiculturalism, immigration of nonwhites and low birth rates among whites are threatening the white race, and some believe these things are being promoted as part of an attempted genocide.

And the same paragraph with a few substitutions:

> [Sunni militants] say they seek to ensure the survival of the [caliphate], and the cultures of historically [Islamic] states. They hold that [Islamic] people should maintain their majority in majority-[Islamic] countries, maintain their political and economic dominance, and that their cultures should be foremost. Many [Islamic] nationalists believe that miscegenation, multiculturalism, [and] immigration of [non-muslims] are threatening [Islam], and some believe these things are being promoted as part of an attempted genocide.

ISIS may be comparatively more violent than white nationalists[1] but as far as ideology goes I struggle to see "two very different things" as you've suggested.

[1] At this moment in history at least - the Nazi party certainly fits the Wikipedia definition of "white nationalist".

Re:Facebook to ban white nationalist content by ThomPete on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @05:56PM (#19506517)
Compare them to antifa. Should fb also ban anti capitalist content because some of us thinks its outright antihumanist just as much as white supremacy is?

This is the slippery slope you are walking down here.

Re:Facebook to ban white nationalist content by elliekelly on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @06:25PM (#19506784)
I’m not walking down any slope as I haven’t said anyone should or shouldn’t be allowed to do anything. You said white supremacy “isn’t even remotely like ISIS” and that people only think that because they “haven’t spent the time understanding” so here I am trying to understand.

So far I’m pretty unconvinced.

Re:Facebook to ban white nationalist content by ThomPete on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @06:37PM (#19506893)
I dont think anything will convince you if you dont see the comparison to antifa being more apt than isis.
Re:Facebook to ban white nationalist content by bdhe on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @01:33PM (#19503439)
How so?
[dead]
Re:Facebook to ban white nationalist content by ThomPete on Wednesday March 27, 2019 @02:31PM (#19504323)
You are damn right I would ask people to research what things actually mean before they go claiming other people spread fascist propaganda.

I am perfectly capable of both trying to understand the world I live and why some people think what they think and at the same time disagreeing with them.

If you think you are helping fight their ideology by banning it you are going to be sorely disappointed. That will not end well.