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Re:My experiment with smart drugs: Viagra for the brain? by mattmaroon on Thursday May 15, 2008 @05:01PM (#190949)
Right or wrong is irrelevant. They're all bad for you when used frequently. I'm pretty sure that's why the person who said that meant you shouldn't take them, not for any moral reasons.
Re:My experiment with smart drugs: Viagra for the brain? by tdavis on Thursday May 15, 2008 @08:51PM (#191260)
"Bad" is subjective.

I drink caffeine to stay awake or to wake up; getting my work done is not "bad" for me. I drink alcohol and smoke cigarettes because smoking is relaxing and helps me concentrate and drinking... I won't get into that here. I exercise because it makes me feel good. I eat healthy because I think non-junk food just tastes better.

In my mind, all of these things are not "bad" for me. Some may be bad for my physical health, but if physical health were humans' only consideration we would all live in plastic bubbles and eat synthesized protein mash or something. If somebody wants to take Provigil for 30 years and it effectively doubles their productivity and concentration while at the end of which turning their mind to mush, who are we to judge?

Re:My experiment with smart drugs: Viagra for the brain? by aaronblohowiak on Friday May 16, 2008 @05:02AM (#191614)
Right, we should probably use "effective for N" or "inhibits X" instead of good/bad, right/wrong.

Value judgments used to be effectiveness positions, wherin N and X were assumed to be common among people (or at least were implied to be superior to any dissenting view.)

Re:My experiment with smart drugs: Viagra for the brain? by fallentimes on Thursday May 15, 2008 @05:04PM (#190954)
That's not true either, especially for caffeine (particularly when consumed via coffee) and alcohol (it depends on your definition of frequently).
Re:My experiment with smart drugs: Viagra for the brain? by aaronblohowiak on Thursday May 15, 2008 @05:16PM (#190973)
Anxiety and sleep disorders,irritability, caffeine dependency (addiction that has withdraw symptoms such as headaches, drowsiness, nausea,) peptic ulcers, ge reflux, increased rates of Parkinson's disease in men, and such.

Dependence isn't something I desire.

Re:My experiment with smart drugs: Viagra for the brain? by fallentimes on Thursday May 15, 2008 @05:31PM (#190993)
Benefits of coffee: Increased sexual drive, increased mental awareness, reduced diabetes risk, mood boost, increased endurance, depression, headache and cavity prevention and decreased Parkinson's risk according to this: http://men.webmd.com/features/coffee-new-health-food This study also points out that the benefits are primarily driven by the caffeine, not the coffee.

I think you're confusing dependence with consistent usage.

Aaron, I see what you're saying, but even the healthiest food in the world or exercise can be bad for you if you over do it.

People often have a knee jerk reaction to drugs: if it alters the mind/body in some way it's bad. I'm saying this notion isn't always true and drugs, when used properly or even, occasionally, for recreation purposes (shown in the article) can have myriad benefits. But as always I enjoy the intelligent discussion provided HN that feels so rare on the rest of the web...

Re:My experiment with smart drugs: Viagra for the brain? by aaronblohowiak on Thursday May 15, 2008 @06:16PM (#191073)
I did misread my source.. it may show a decreased risk of Parkinson's. Apologies.

Dependence, as I understand it, is where the consumption of a substance is required to maintain normal functioning, and absence of that substance leads to predictable withdrawal symptoms. Caffeine withdrawal: http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/Press_releases/2004/09_29_04....

As has been said before "it is the dose that makes the poison." I also agree that we should weigh the pros and cons of each decision before it is made, and not react irrationally. While the prevalence and social expectation of caffeine usage often discourage dissent, the question of the value of sobriety and intoxication is an individual one. Near as I can tell, caffeine addiction is something our society takes for granted.

I don't believe in blanket prohibitions or any other construct that'd diminish a sovereign person's right to chose their own adventure. I just think we should make the decision to consume our vices intentionally, and with all the facts.

Re:My experiment with smart drugs: Viagra for the brain? by r7000 on Friday May 16, 2008 @09:54AM (#191765)
Regular coffee/caffeine may also keep the blood-brain barrier strong as you age: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/7326839.stm
Re:My experiment with smart drugs: Viagra for the brain? by radu_floricica on Saturday May 17, 2008 @02:48AM (#192494)
Frequently... maybe. A lot of people here pointed out caffeine. I'm going with aspirin: low daily doses are recommended for everybody over 50. Vitamins, too, the whole long list. Mineral suplements. Alcohol, mostly low quantities of red wine.

I think we as a society (and I don't talk about americans only, i'm european) have a huge alergic reaction to using medicine for non-healing purposes. I never really understood why. Of course, there are the rational risks, but it looks too much like a gut reaction. Maybe is related to the fact that people avoid doctors in general?

Some day we are going to have safe drugs that can make us live 20 years longer and a lot better, and we're not going to realize it. And if that day was in the 80s, we wouldn't know it.

Re:My experiment with smart drugs: Viagra for the brain? by rms on Saturday May 17, 2008 @02:50AM (#192496)
From PG's recent essay, I think it's because we're taught from a young age that drugs are bad. And they are kind of bad, but really it's much more complicated than that.