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A comment on Most People With Addiction Grow Out of It (2014). Parent comment

Re:Most People With Addiction Grow Out of It (2014) by thrownaway954 on Monday January 28, 2019 @06:47AM (#19016722)
Your perception of AA is based on ignorance. AA is not a "get the drunks to worship god instead" program... It is suggested that you find a higher power, but not required. Remember..."Our book is meant to be suggested only, we realise we know only a little."

I go to Agnostic meetings that don't involve any prayer or spiritual aspect, just a group of drunks gathered together helping each other to stay sober. So if the whole religious or spiritual aspect of the program leaves a bad taste in your mouth, try finding a secular meeting in your area: https://secularaa.org/tsml_meeting/

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Re:Most People With Addiction Grow Out of It (2014) by avar on Monday January 28, 2019 @02:28PM (#19020289)
What am I supposedly ignorant about? That AA is a religious sobriety program? The next sentence of the "Our book..." quote you've cited is "God will disclose more to you and to us". So perhaps it's not not doing the work you think it is.

In any case, the motivation for my comment was to point out that many of these "xA" programs are inspired by the 12-step "AA" program. That program is not scientific, or even amenable to change as new evidence about the efficacy of sobriety comes in.

Rather, it's dogma. Whatever white-washing of AA's mention of "God" over the years as "higher power" doesn't change the fact that it's not science-based.

Does that mean it's completely useless? No, but as others have pointed out studies of its effectiveness are rather damning[1]. It just bears pointing out when treatments for addiction are discussed that AA is a dogma-based therapy, because many people suffering from addiction think AA is just what you're supposed to do.

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Effectiveness_of_Alcoholics_An...

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Re:Most People With Addiction Grow Out of It (2014) by thrownaway954 on Monday January 28, 2019 @04:56PM (#19021473)
"That AA is a religious sobriety program" - exactly that. It is a suggested spiritual sobriety program with an emphasis on "suggestive". It's not a religious program what-so-ever. They use the word God to incubus whatever "higher power" a member chooses (or chooses not to) believe in. I'll give you that God was an EXTREMELY POOR choice for the word, but it's what everyone could relate to at the time. In any case, don't let the fact that God is mentioned in the book confuse you, it's already confused most.
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Re:Most People With Addiction Grow Out of It (2014) by taurath on Monday January 28, 2019 @07:24PM (#19022562)
This is disingenuous. The entire history of AA up to and including now (literally read any 12 step guide, 8+ steps mention God) is pushing a protestant christian philosophy that man is irreparably fallen and flawed and the only salvation is through a higher power, and that you must give up your self and any semblance of control to that abstraction.

It works for some, but anyone who says its not a christian organization is absolutely lying - its like taking the caramel coloring out of cola - its still cola, it still tastes like cola, you just took away the color that reminds people that its cola.

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