"Cars seem unnecessary in densely populated cities. Most high-density areas have good public transport within a few minutes walk of your destination, and the roads are too busy to drive a car on anyway."

FTFY

Cars address a different set of requirements. You use one when you need to transport many people, heavy cargo, tools, etc. A scooter does not solve any of those problems.

A scooter does allow a single person and their possessions to travel at faster than walking pace without getting sweaty. In the CBD that is not necessary, since public transport works so well. In the suburbs a scooter is more effective.

Sure, but look at your typical freeway rush hour traffic jam— how many of those vehicles really have multiple people or heavy cargo?

The point is that for short commutes and as a last mile solution to extend the coverage of public transit, scooters are amazing. And a rental system means they can stay downtown instead of needing to take up space both ways on the mass transit vehicle.

> Sure, but look at your typical freeway rush hour traffic jam - how many of those vehicles really have multiple people or heavy cargo?

I'm not sure how that's relevant. You edited my comment to try and make it apply to cars, but it does not - cars are necessary both in the CBD and out for instances where you need to transport cargo etc, while scooters are less necessary in the CBD if you can use good public transport instead.

The fact that many people use cars when they aren't necessary is not relevant, other than to note that there's a lot of potential to reduce traffic by replacing single-occupant cars with personal transport.

And I'm not claiming that scooters or scooter rentals are bad - I love my scooter and see scooter rental companies as a big part of reducing the number of cars on the road. But why do they insist on deploying in areas where scooters are not wanted? Why not focus on the areas where they are most practical?

> But why do they insist on deploying in areas where scooters are not wanted? Why not focus on the areas where they are most practical?

Because the most population-dense areas (NYC, SF) also happen to have the highest density of VC investment money.

I agree with you all the way up until here! I live in Miami, where single-passenger cars are king. Scooters would be great here. But the cities that would benefit most from scooters are not exactly overflowing with investment money.

Which American city are you living in where public transport is so excellent?

Except you don't. You use them every single time you need to get somewhere, no matter how far or how many people.

Sure - because cars have been most peoples only practical mode of transport for decades and it has become their default.

Now that scooters and ebikes are offering a very practical alternative to driving, cars no longer need to be the default choice when travelling and we can expect their use to decline.

High-density areas typically have bike lanes for scooters to use.

The problem of getting ~3 miles in a city like SF (SoMa to Mission) involves a 10 min walk to a train, and several more minutes walking once you get off the train, or walking to a bus stop and waiting 10+ mins there, with another walk to your destination. 10-15 minute car or scooter trips easily become 45+ min public transport trips.

I find it preposterous than any cyclist would want to share their very limited bike lanes with random people on rented scooters.

Hi, regular cyclist in both San Francisco and the East Bay. Rented scooters are slow and erratic and a touch annoying to me. But, I'd rather share the road with a scooter than a car any day. Do scooters remove cars from the road, especially for short trips? I dunno, but I'd be willing to bet they do.

Worth it. More scooters, please.

I bike to work everyday in the east bay and have no issues sharing what little infrastructure bikes have with scooters. I can easily pass them in most instances and if not they are no slower than a slow cyclist. So far 0 issues except when they go the wrong way but cyclists are also guilty of this. Compared to cars which have clipped me a couple times and routinely park in the bike lanes.

Cycling is my only mode of transportation. I don't own a car and no longer take the bus. (Before I got my bike, the bus was my sole mode of transportation.) I bike to and from work every day (~6mi round trip) in addition to thousands of miles of recreational biking every year.

I'm in Austin where we have Lime, Bird, and Jump, and while I personally have yet to try the scooters, I strongly support more people riding electric scooters and believe the bike lane is the right place for them, at least out of the current options.

I don't hate the idea of having bike lanes and separate scooter lanes, but since we can't even manage to get bike lanes everywhere, I'm happy to go with putting them on the bike lanes.

I have to ride in the road for most of my commute, and a lot of human drivers are scary dangerous bad. Scooter riders are never more than annoying, and usually I can just pass them without difficulty if they're going slowly (which most are from a bike perspective). Most importantly, if they hit me, I'll likely be fine. (I've been hit by cars twice over the past ten years and I was fine in those instances too, but it's not my favorite experience. I've also had drivers try to force me off the road. People on their scooters don't do that.)

I find it preposterous when pedestrians expect bicycles and scooters to expose themselves to life-threatening dangers, by sharing a roadway with two-tonne motorized vehicles.

You are 100% right. As a biker I would prefer to be on the sidewalk. It's safer and less scary. As a pedestrian, I prefer bikers stay off the sidewalk. It's safer and less scary.

But when you consider the big picture, I think it's obvious that cars kill cyclists and pedestrians in the street much, MUCH more often that bikes kill pedestrians on the sidewalk.

Then you should probably just walk.

As opposed to random people on bikes? Cyclists love to parrot the “share the road” mantra — until they actually have to share the road. There is nothing “better” about a bike that should give it some esteemed status. I have personally had more negative interactions with cyclists in cities than scooter riders. Is it the motor that bothers you? Because if that’s the case, then let’s enforce bike lane speed limits and treat all modes of light two-wheel transit equally.

You’ve clearly not lived in San Francisco. My 3 mile commute takes 45 minutes by bus. It’s only a 30 minute bike or scooter ride.

I don’t think that bus can ever be defined as “good public transport” in a dense metropolitan area. Trains or light rails are probably what gp was speaking about.

I found the buses in Beijing to be "good public transport" as long as a) you could do the entire journey on one bus, or one transfer where a lot of buses could be used to get to your destination, b) the beginning stop was close to your location and the ending stop was close to your destination, and c) both stops were served by multiple lines. Given that buses in Beijing are spaced an average of about 10 min apart, C means that you didn't have to wait long for the bus. The subway travels faster, but you typically have to walk ten minutes on either end, so the bus will win. I frequently used the bus on routes that satisfied all conditions.

The down side is that you need to be familiar with Chinese characters, and do a lot of clicking and zooming in and out at ditu.google.cn beforehand.

Rapid Bus systems work very well when heading towards suburbs.

That's true e.g. in Paris.

However I have moved to San Francisco, and 2 months afterwards I just bought an electric longboard.

Public transportation sucks in this city compared to any great european large city.

Wait 20 minutes for a bus. Or take a scooter 20 blocks instead. How do I take the bus from Chinatown to Fisherman’s Wharf? By the time I figured that out, I’d be halfway there. Scooters represent speed and mobility. Buses represent crowds and waiting. Besides scooters are actually fun. A bus is an exercise in patience and time-wasting. If China followed your advice, Shanghai would be a continuous line of buses covering every square inch of road. Those that hate scooters have never used one.