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Re:Tesla (TSLA) surpasses BMW's valuation as one soars and t... by gamblor956 on Thursday November 08, 2018 @11:05AM (#18407182)
Your greatly overstating Tesla's advantages. EV drivetrains aren't quite drop in replacements but they are close enough that the first modern commercial EVs... including Tesla...were simply converted ICE vehicles.

Also, Tesla doesn't make batteries, Panasonic does. Tesla just assembles them. Panasonic also sells batteries to Tesla's competition. And based on Tesla's past issues with paying vendors, if they miss even a single payment to Panasonic their supply advantage could disappear immediately.

Re:Tesla (TSLA) surpasses BMW's valuation as one soars and t... by 013a on Thursday November 08, 2018 @02:17PM (#18409034)
Of course the first ones were converted ICE vehicles. I could take a lawnmover and make it electric, that doesn't mean it would feasibly compete with a true designed-from-scratch electric lawnmower.

Those first EVs designed like that sucked. Seriously. Horrible range. Bad part fit. The roadster in a Lotus body was a fast car with decent range, but it also weighed almost nothing, had two seats, and no storage capacity. Come on, you're smarter than to think that's a good argument.

Look at Audi and the e-tron. They're advertising "200+ miles of range", but the only real road test we've heard about so far had it below that, at closer to 175. Meanwhile, the Model X is getting up to 300. And, by the way, before you say it: Yes, the price on both of these is about the same, at the $80k mark.

Consider the Bolt. It's got a range of ~240mi. For roughly the same price (~$40k), a Model 3 will do 310, and it will do those miles with substantially better performance and AWD (and also not look like a squished minivan, beside the point).

Who else is there? The Leaf? Ford Focus Electric? BMW i3? Hilarious. I'm tired of this argument that "the traditional manufacturers will catch up." It's the same argument we were making 4 years ago, 2 years ago, 6 months ago, nothing has changed. They haven't caught up. It's seemingly increasingly likely that the 2021 model year cars might compete with what Tesla is putting out today, in 2018. What will Tesla have by then? Who's to say.

These companies aren't doomed; the car market is vastly large enough to have many many people competing. But Tesla is in a position today to be #1 for a very long time. Their valuation will level off to be more realistic as their revenue catches up with the hype.

Re:Tesla (TSLA) surpasses BMW's valuation as one soars and t... by gamblor956 on Thursday November 08, 2018 @06:57PM (#18411172)
For roughly the same price (~$40k), a Model 3 will do 310, and it will do those miles with substantially better performance and AWD (and also not look like a squished minivan, beside the point).

Categorically false, as the Model 3s do not currently sell for that amount with that range. Cheapest model 3 is $46k, without upgrades.

Can't find anything about the electric-only etron, which hasn't been released yet. The hybrid etron only has 16 miles of pure EV range. BMW's I3 is a superior riding experience, range and acceleration aside. Even the Leaf and Focus Electric are nicer to ride in. After the novelty of "Ludicrous" mode wears off, the actual driver experience matters most to most car buyers. Considering that most people don't have a 150-mile commute, the Model 3's only advantage is for the hypothetical holiday drive. Most people would just rather have a nicer car.

Re:Tesla (TSLA) surpasses BMW's valuation as one soars and t... by leesec on Thursday November 08, 2018 @07:55PM (#18411531)
Really, they would? Then why are they all buying Teslas?

Also you're crazy if you think either of those cars are 'nicer' than a Model 3, which has rave reviews from its customers and critics.

Re:Tesla (TSLA) surpasses BMW's valuation as one soars and t... by greglindahl on Thursday November 08, 2018 @07:45PM (#18411481)
The mid-range Model 3 is $46,000 before US federal and state tax incentives. "Categorically false" appears to be an exaggeration, but that fits with your overall posting quality.
Re:Tesla (TSLA) surpasses BMW's valuation as one soars and t... by greglindahl on Thursday November 08, 2018 @07:41PM (#18411459)
The Roadster wasn't a "converted ICE vehicle". Only the outer shell was from Lotus. That's a relatively small % of the weight and value of the car.
Re:Tesla (TSLA) surpasses BMW's valuation as one soars and t... by leesec on Thursday November 08, 2018 @12:18PM (#18407879)
Yes those cars were converted ICE vehicles... in 2008. Sounds like a multi year advantage to me.
Re:Tesla (TSLA) surpasses BMW's valuation as one soars and t... by gamblor956 on Thursday November 08, 2018 @06:58PM (#18411181)
No fewer than a dozen car companies are planning to launch more advanced EVs than Tesla within the next 3 years.

Tesla can't afford the capital investment it needs to compete with that generation of competition, largely because it executed this generation's launch so poorly.

Re:Tesla (TSLA) surpasses BMW's valuation as one soars and t... by leesec on Thursday November 08, 2018 @07:54PM (#18411525)
Lol honestly are you trolling?

Tesla has 50% of the EV market share and is by far the leader in tech. I would love to see anything even close to the specs of the new roadster. Or honestly if any company has any plans for anything as good as the Model S that would be great.

And wouldn't 3 years away give Tesla a multi-year advantage, as claimed?