News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:We posed as 100 Senators to run ads on Facebook. Facebook... by bluecalm on Tuesday October 30, 2018 @07:39PM (#18342171)
Can they pay for their own website? What about a website about their ideas? What about linking to that website? Limiting speech like that sounds dystopian. It's sure great for established players though as they are already known and get a lot of air time anyway while the competition can't even pay to try to convince others to their ideas.
Re:We posed as 100 Senators to run ads on Facebook. Facebook... by asdfasgasdgasdg on Tuesday October 30, 2018 @08:28PM (#18342434)
> Limiting speech like that sounds dystopian.

This oft repeated refrain r.e. more restrictive speech laws is something that I don't really understand. You can look at Europe or Canada and see that they are no dystopias, compared to the United States. There are ways they are better and ways they are worse, but there is no consensus that either is a significantly worse place to live than the USA.

Re:We posed as 100 Senators to run ads on Facebook. Facebook... by SmellyGeekBoy on Wednesday October 31, 2018 @06:56AM (#18344648)
> It's sure great for established players though as they are already known and get a lot of air time anyway while the competition can't even pay to try to convince others to their ideas.

Odd that you'd make this point on a comment about France. Perhaps read up on Macron some time.

Re:We posed as 100 Senators to run ads on Facebook. Facebook... by hadrien01 on Tuesday October 30, 2018 @07:52PM (#18342242)
They can have their own website, but only promoted through organic means.

> Limiting speech like that sounds dystopian

Europe, with its vastly different past, has a very different view on free speech compared to the US. We don't allow unlimited free speech, but we don't view that as censorship. Nazi symbols are banned in Germany. Hate speech is condemned through most of Europe (one of our far-right politicians in France has been condemned, and I think rightly so, for dismissing Holocaust as a 'detail of history').

You see that as a dystopia. I see that as a better political and social environment.

Re:We posed as 100 Senators to run ads on Facebook. Facebook... by YSFEJ4SWJUVU6 on Tuesday October 30, 2018 @10:40PM (#18342953)
>We don't allow unlimited free speech, but we don't view that as censorship.

Speak for yourself. I certainly think blasphemy laws are certainly way past their due date, and more extreme restrictions (e.g. like in Germany, but notably not everywhere in Europe) definitely at least borderline on the dystopian side.

And as to what an average citizen might think: perhaps an average Chinese considers their “free speech” laws, or their closest equivalent, quite reasonable after having been taught so all their life. Europe could certainly do with freer speech.

Re:We posed as 100 Senators to run ads on Facebook. Facebook... by int_19h on Wednesday October 31, 2018 @12:07AM (#18343278)
It's still censorship, by definition. You have just decided that it's worth it, but let's be clear about what it is.

Funny thing is, for all your hate speech laws, far right parties don't seem to be much frustrated by them, and are quite successful at competing for votes lately. All they have to do is wink and nudge without spelling things out bluntly - everybody still knows what they mean and what they stand for.

Re:We posed as 100 Senators to run ads on Facebook. Facebook... by chrismanfrank on Tuesday October 30, 2018 @08:34PM (#18342467)
> You see that as a dystopia. I see that as a better political and social environment.

The question then is...should YOU be the one to decide what is "better"? Who should be given that kind of power?

In an ideal world, a benevolent philosopher king would have that power. In the real world, maybe it's best no one has it.

Maybe it's better to cast the ring into the fire.

Re:We posed as 100 Senators to run ads on Facebook. Facebook... by wyattpeak on Tuesday October 30, 2018 @09:29PM (#18342679)
This sort of argument is the ultimate dead end. Shall we have no legislation on anything which isn't universally considered beneficial?

Besides which, choosing no legislation is a choice in itself. Having no law on speech isn't a middle-ground, it's an extreme. It's an understandable extreme, and though I disagree with it in limited fashion I don't think it's an unreasonable case to make. But it is nevertheless not the balanced middle-ground choice you're presenting it as.

Re:We posed as 100 Senators to run ads on Facebook. Facebook... by IncRnd on Tuesday October 30, 2018 @10:30PM (#18342913)
This sort of argument is not a dead end but the very essence of government. Asking how much power should be given to a government is vitally important to the citizens and is certainly not a dead end.
Re:We posed as 100 Senators to run ads on Facebook. Facebook... by wyattpeak on Tuesday October 30, 2018 @10:54PM (#18343011)
I'm not disagreeing with the idea that speech legislation should be debated. I'm disagreeing with the conclusion that, since there is no consensus, it's best that there is no legislation at all.
Re:We posed as 100 Senators to run ads on Facebook. Facebook... by chrismanfrank on Wednesday October 31, 2018 @12:31AM (#18343371)
Well now you've raised a very deep point. We need some laws and regulation, but not too much. How do we decide? We have a Constitution and a political system, including judiciary where we can all fight it out.

Conservatives are more on the side of limited government power. Progressives think the government should do more. And on and on it goes...