Yet they’re treated exactly the opposite by the evangelicals. It’s a bit of a mindfuck until you realize it’s not really about religion at all.
I really did not get that impression at all from his book Dreams From My Father. A quick Google suggests that both his father and mother were atheists at points in their life. I do know that Obama did attend church more often as he started to move into politics.
I doubt this: he rather either believes that he is personally chosen by God or God himself. :-)
Huh, I didn't realize Presbyterians were atheist...
I take it you never look south.
in reality, its just another religion.
true atheists, are like true feminists; god/gender, simply doesn't enter into the mix.
I enjoy the company of both; but not, their intellectual progeny. And neither, do they.
The only thing I have seen is a wish to have bureaucracy and officialdom recognise "no belief in god" as an equally valid box to tick as CofE. For decades half of those ticking CofE or any of the non-conformist options were a vote for atheism. There's no box, tick what my family grandparents would have.
If I had to summarise UK views, most simply don't seem to care, or see the point of a supernatural being, a god, or some ancient human rules that restrict what you can eat or if you may control your reproduction. If you need tobacco or some deity to get through life have at it.
Humanism, some sort of earth centred belief, or Buddhism thanks to its philosophy and lack of creator have all risen as religion has become increasingly irrelevant for most.
> Just the odd individual going off on one on some Facebook post or other net forum from time to time.
I discuss theology on a fairly regular basis ;) and philosophy. ;) lets just say there's a fair amount of "ex-Christians" who are looking for something new to latch on. Same old shit (hate/misanthropy), just wrapped in new cloth.
> "no belief in god" as an equally valid box to tick as CofE
Just leave it blank. What to your mind, is the purpose of having an explicit box? I'm curious.
> Humanism, some sort of earth centred belief, or Buddhism thanks to its philosophy and lack of creator have all risen as religion has become increasingly irrelevant for most.
Eh. I know Buddhist philosophy well. Few people get it. My friend who is an atheist (in the truest sense) is a humanist. So am I. Thats why we're friends. :) But he respects my choice to follow a religion; same as I respect his choice, to follow none.
OK, that makes some sense. I don't think many have "committed" to religion and church in the UK for a century or more, compared to the enthusiasm that appears to exist in the US. Even many of those who openly believed rarely actually went regularly.
One formerly quite religious friend who lost faith in his mid or late 40s seemed quite apathetic for a while after. From my perspective looking on that was more that he lost the community, and group activities that he once regularly attended. Perhaps joining a new group or replacing the missing sense family would appeal. Thankfully atheist evangelists and militancy aren't a thing here outside of Dawkins. :)
> What to your mind, is the purpose of having an explicit box? I'm curious.
Hospitals might want to dispose of me in an appropriate manner if the risky operation fails. Passport applications insist on it (I think. It's been 8 years or so since my last). The clerk filling in the screen doesn't get much choice if it's a mandatory field they can't skip. It's sometimes gathered to try and ensure a lack of discrimination across large organisations.
> But he respects my choice to follow a religion; same as I respect his choice, to follow none.
This seems to nail it. Religion, belief, spirituality and atheism has become a personal thing separate and unrelated to organised religions in the UK.
wink.
> One formerly quite religious friend who lost faith in his mid or late 40s seemed quite apathetic for a while after.
runs deeper than that. people who are religious, usually are religious because it made sense. but the corruption in organized religion in the west, is difficult to reconcile with the actual tenets of a faith. so when they abandon their church; they still have the same needs that drew them - but now their is no path forward for fulfillment. Religion (in the purest sense), does have a purpose.
> Thankfully atheist evangelists and militancy aren't a thing here outside of Dawkins. :)
Indeed, you are somewhat blessed in this respect. I've always preferred a good conversation.
> Passport applications insist on it (I think. It's been 8 years or so since my last)
that would seem to be the thing to rectify. Unless your legal system is based on religious code; mandatory religious disclosure would seem to be a bit "impolitic".
> This seems to nail it.
He's a good person. So am I. Good people, prefer the company, of good people. Thus, has it always been.
> Religion, belief, spirituality and atheism has become a personal thing separate and unrelated to organised religions in the UK.
You guys have had a rough time of it. Speaking from a historical/religious perspective.
I'm not surprised by Western Christians jettisoning their "faiths". But it would be nice if they didn't impute the Western failures, say on Eastern or Middle-Eastern Christianity (which are vastly different creatures).
It distorts the mind, to project local problems, on all of humanity. Each culture is different; each takes a different path.
If you are from the UK, what could you possibly know about the US? I'm atheist and have been since 12 or so. My parents are christian. Never had any issues like you described in my entire life.
Stop believing exaggerated nonsense from for-profit companies like the new yorker as truths. It's more clickbait fiction than anything.
Sure the US may be more religious than other countries. But there are plenty of atheists and agnostics and every other religion and non-religions around. And people get along fine.
Frankly, my perception of the UK ( which I've never visited but I've read about so that makes an exper ) is that the atheists in the UK are far more zealous and militant than the religious in the US. But I'm guessing I know as much about the UK as you do about the US.
Edit: Typo. Also real billboard: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Discrimination_against_atheist...
But yes I might have overreached a bit.
I'm glad to hear that your (un)religious opinion hasn't affected your life, but I'm thinking specifically about the political arena: The fact that Bernie Sanders has to deny being an atheist, and that Zuckerberg has to suddenly pretend to be religious because he has political ambitions. Things like that just dont happen over here. No-one is particularly interested in the religion or lack thereof of politicians, and it really doesn't get discussed much. (edit: Northern Ireland is a very complicated exception to this)
Perhaps quoting Chomsky here isn't a great idea but according to him, the United States is a very fundamentalist, religious country – one of the most extreme in the world. https://chomsky.info/01312016/
re: Zealous Atheists in the UK - well we did produce Dawkins but generally atheists over here dont have much to complain about because we are a genuinely secular society. People like Dawkins tend to turn their attention to other countries. And because we're secular, most people don't really have to spend much time thinking what they 'are' at all, in that sense.