News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Helm: Personal Email Server by djsumdog on Wednesday October 17, 2018 @10:31AM (#18239421)
So if they route everything through the same set of EC2 instances, that might actually take care of the SPAM issue. I run my own e-mail server and have run into that same issue of not being able to send to gmail/microsoft addresses (unless I contact the person via Facebook/Twitter/Reddit/etc. and tell them to check their spam folder):

https://penguindreams.org/blog/how-google-and-microsoft-made...

The way most of these providers deal with spam is they slowly white-list IP addresses. When a company like Mailchip or Mailgun spin up a new server, it's always in a large subnet range they've purchased and they slowly start sending low priority e-mail through it to existing/known receivers and throttle it up to full speed.

If you're running a personal server that sends like 5 or 6 e-mails a days, well that's an issue.

The big players make it difficult to run a small personal server, but running a dedicated business or corporate server that sends 100s of e-mails per day is typically fine once it's well established.

You know what would be a better product? A relay SMTP server that works with Google/Microsoft/Amazon/Fastmail et. al. to pump e-mail from personal servers and ensures it won't get caught in spam filters.

Re:Helm: Personal Email Server by zrail on Wednesday October 17, 2018 @10:46AM (#18239573)
"You know what would be a better product? A relay SMTP server that works with Google/Microsoft/Amazon/Fastmail et. al. to pump e-mail from personal servers and ensures it won't get caught in spam filters."

That's basically Sendgrid or Mailgun or even Fastmail itself. They can all relay SMTP for arbitrary domains.

Re:Helm: Personal Email Server by ryan-c on Wednesday October 17, 2018 @11:29AM (#18240010)
It's actually a totally different product vs Sendgrid/Mailgun/etc.

Such a product would need to have a ToS that states it can only be used for low volume personal and business correspondence, and have per-account rate limiting to enforce that. Doing it this way is necessary to avoid having mail treated as bulk.

I've tried relaying through mailgun to get mail to outlook.com, it does not work.

Re:Helm: Personal Email Server by tyre on Wednesday October 17, 2018 @12:47PM (#18240906)
Rate-limiting would be interesting. If the cost of the service was specifically high enough to be unscalable. Like, $10 per month and you can send 200 emails per day. That’s expensive compared to anything else but fine for personal use.
Re:Helm: Personal Email Server by aidenn0 on Wednesday October 17, 2018 @04:42PM (#18243602)
fastmail already is available for $10 per month, so I guess problem solved?
Re:Helm: Personal Email Server by ryan-c on Wednesday October 17, 2018 @06:13PM (#18244302)
Do they handle a send-only smarthost configuration that allows arbitrary from addresses within a domain?
Re:Helm: Personal Email Server by zrail on Wednesday October 17, 2018 @07:51PM (#18244839)
As far as I can tell, yeah.
Re:Helm: Personal Email Server by vonseel on Wednesday October 17, 2018 @10:25PM (#18245441)
Pretty soon email will require stamps, like paper mail. I wonder if they will sell forever stamps?

Jk, I just thought it was funny that we pay for services which were always seen as a free alternative to paper mail and stamps were a thing of the past.

Re:Helm: Personal Email Server by pmontra on Thursday October 18, 2018 @01:11AM (#18246078)
Proof of Work basically was invented to cope with email spam. That's more or less a stamp.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hashcash

Re:Helm: Personal Email Server by Fnoord on Thursday October 18, 2018 @05:09AM (#18246977)
If you have a KvK in The Netherlands your PII details are public, and you will start receiving physical spam from companies despite such spam not being free to send. I never receive spam from individuals though; only companies.

On top of that, the costs of electricity are not the same everywhere (they are very expensive in The Netherlands, for example, than in the USA, and China is very cheap). Nor is it widely stable available everywhere (examples include India and Africa). Proof of Work is basically a waste of energy as well.

Re:Helm: Personal Email Server by oliverx0 on Thursday October 18, 2018 @05:15AM (#18246995)
How about https://postmarkapp.com/ ? It is more tailored to "transactional emails", but seems pretty close to what you describe
Re:Helm: Personal Email Server by lytedev on Wednesday October 17, 2018 @09:53PM (#18245332)
But this is exactly what I use mailgun for. The free price point kind of enforces that.

Maybe it's just been so long I'm whitelisted?

Re:Helm: Personal Email Server by vsl on Thursday October 18, 2018 @12:28AM (#18245914)
More likely you actually set it up correctly, with DKIM and stuff, and the parent didn’t.
Re:Helm: Personal Email Server by ryan-c on Thursday October 18, 2018 @12:01PM (#18249420)
I had everything set up correctly, including DMARC. I've been doing this a long, long time.
Re:Helm: Personal Email Server by jiveturkey on Thursday October 25, 2018 @05:17PM (#18304653)
> The big players make it difficult to run a small personal server

how so? the way i see it, only by making it too easy to use them. if you mean, they reject mail from (eg) dynamically assigned home subscriber IP addresses, you can blame spammers for that, not the big email players.

There's little to no additional security from having email on-site, and much hassle. Assuming you use google or outlook, the advertising bogeyman is just that - a bogeyman.

this is a super niche product, with a lot of useless industro-consumer design thrown in. it's doomed as a business and then where are you? back to gmail.