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Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by salimmadjd on Friday June 22, 2018 @05:09PM (#17377378)
Mr. Schulte had been charged last year in New York with possession of child pornography

Very interesting! It almost seems like the pornography charges against him was a way to punish him but without prosecuting him for the actual leakage. Perhaps the government wanted to still point the fingers at someone else or avoid embarrassment?

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by TomMckenny on Friday June 22, 2018 @06:40PM (#17378098)
States, even relatively benevolent ones, take any steps necessary to secure national secrets, even extra legal ones.

Take the likelihood that a leaky contractor coincidently is a pedophile. One who works in security yet encrypts stuff with the same cellphone password everywhere.

Balance that with the possibility that a motivated state actor could plant such files on a pc or alter logs on a server they are monitoring.

Coincidentally also, it is very much sufficient for a jury to convict yet the accusation is ambiguous/obvious enough to deter other would be leakers.

I have no idea whether this is a good way to do things but it's a pretty widespread set of coincidences that would also happen to have a particular effect.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by anonymous5133 on Friday June 22, 2018 @07:52PM (#17378518)
Completely agree. The narrative being presented is simply not logical to believe. Based on the narrative, this guy works for the cia, highly likely he knows cp is illegal, obtains cp, knows how to use encryption but then uses a weak password.

Not using a weak password is like security 101 first 5 minutes of the first class type of knowledge.

Im sure im not the only one buying this story.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by Cacti on Friday June 22, 2018 @07:56PM (#17378539)
You’re making an assumption, that it was weak. What we know is that they found the password on his phone. It could have been quite strong.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by bb88 on Friday June 22, 2018 @08:05PM (#17378569)
I think the question I have is did the guy have a password manager on his phone?
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by DINKDINK on Friday June 22, 2018 @09:39PM (#17378936)
The question we need to answer is: Was the incriminating data planted or not. Having a password manager on his phone is tangental to answer that question. After the computer and phone left his custody, either device could have had data modified. Unless he's got his data pinned into the Bitcoin blockchain, it's a pretty hard to show that it was planted. If it wasn't planted then it's really just about how the key was revealed.

P.S. The description does seem to describe a password manager: "Specifically, the Cellphone Examination identified various passwords that had been input by the user of the Cellphone to, for example, access the phone, applications on the phone, and/or certain websites."

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by jumper_F00BA2 on Saturday June 23, 2018 @02:07AM (#17379794)
I think the level of security provided by passwords or password managers is probably of little import, when confronted by a nation-state actor, and indeed a top tier nation-state actor, with nigh unlimited resources, and an axe to grind over a serious grudge.

We have wi-fi routers being used to passively see through walls, with enough fidelity to read lips and record finger movement.

Put someone under a microscope long enough, and every single password they use will reveal itself. Whether locked behind a manager app (sooner or later you'll snag the master password for it) or directly entered.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by ben_w on Saturday June 23, 2018 @05:45AM (#17380411)
> We have wi-fi routers being used to passively see through walls, with enough fidelity to read lips and record finger movement.

That’s terrifying. I had no idea that was possible despite it being published years ago and trying to keep track of technology like that: https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/7384744/

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by Cacti on Friday June 22, 2018 @09:10PM (#17378820)
This is a big blank spot in the complaint, which tells me they broke or got around the encryption somehow. If it was in cleartext they would have said so because it would have added to their case.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by squarefoot on Friday June 22, 2018 @08:22PM (#17378652)
I also wonder: if I was going to work for the CIA, wouldn't they triple check everything about what I do before hiring me? Whether the child porn evidence was real or planted, the agency doesn't seem to gain much credibility here.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by jonnybgood on Saturday June 23, 2018 @01:37AM (#17379711)
During a security clearance investigation your computer and other personal effects aren't searched.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by donutte on Saturday June 23, 2018 @04:13AM (#17380137)
Reading further down in the docket reveals a few suggestive details. Of particular note, this filing which lead to the revocation of Schulte’s bail [https://www.courtlistener.com/recap/gov.uscourts.nysd.480183...]. Two salient points:

1. Schulte agreed as a condition of his pretrial house arrest not to own, possess, or use a computer or any other form of internet access. Surveillance showed internet connections from his house, accessing his personal email as well as the TOR network.

His attorneys argue that these connections were Schulte’s cousin (who lives with him) checking his email (and TOR?) on his behalf, which after all the Court never said he couldn’t do.

2. At his bail hearing, the prosecutor mentioned a photograph (apparently recovered from Schulte’s phone) showing an unconscious person (apparently Schulte’s roommate) being sexually assaulted (apparently in their shared bathroom). The identity of the assailant having not being established, this wasn’t taken into consideration at pretrial. But...

Since that hearing, the cops in Virginia followed up and have a reasonable suspicion that the person seen in a photograph on Schulte’s phone, sexually assaulting Schulte’s unconscious roommate, in Schulte’s house, might indeed be Schulte himself. So it sounds like he’s facing sexual assault charges in Virginia, as soon as his federal child-porn-cum-treason prosecution gets sorted out.

So... well, even if these additional allegations don’t change your perspective on his character, they proooooobably cut against any presumption of doubt based on dude’s mastery of opsec.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by taneq on Friday June 22, 2018 @07:26PM (#17378381)
This seems to happen remarkably often in cases like these. Remember the Assange rape allegations which turned out to be a setup? It's the next step up from "found drugs in their car".
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by krapp on Friday June 22, 2018 @07:36PM (#17378435)
>Remember the Assange rape allegations which turned out to be a setup?

Sorry, when did they "turn out to be a setup?"

This matter of fact phrasing implies evidence beyond a shadow of a doubt exists which should be commonly known, so if you could cite that, it would be appreciated.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by 22837y on Friday June 22, 2018 @07:28PM (#17378397)
Yeah, those charges are very real. They've continually been upheld in courts in both the UK and Sweden.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by sverige on Friday June 22, 2018 @08:10PM (#17378586)
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by ben_w on Saturday June 23, 2018 @05:50AM (#17380425)
Because they timed out, I thought. Something about him not being formally chargeable until he was in the country, and cases needing to be dropped if there was no formal charge after a certain period.

“Arrested on suspicion” (and “skipping bail”) being separate to that.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by superflyguy on Friday June 22, 2018 @08:09PM (#17378584)
Yes, the charges aren't going away. And because the girl was talked into the rape accusation and then tried to back out of it makes it a set up.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by forapurpose on Saturday June 23, 2018 @01:26AM (#17379688)
Claims in an Internet forum aren't evidence. Also, rape victims back out of accusations all the time because of the trauma involved. Is there evidence?
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by sievebrain on Saturday June 23, 2018 @10:27AM (#17381414)
Yeah, lots in this case. The reason so many say the Assange charges are a setup is that the case was dropped initially by the prosecutor after it became clear the women were lying, their stories simply didn't stack up so there was no chance of a conviction. Assange hung around in Sweden after the charges were filed and requested permission to leave after the charges were dropped, the Swedish police said they were done with him. Then after he left a different prosecutor mysteriously reopened the case and demanded he return for questioning again, though nothing had changed in the case, no charges were filed and the chance of a successful prosecution was still zero.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by forapurpose on Saturday June 23, 2018 @08:24PM (#17384235)
Again I'm reading lots of claims and as everyone knows, claims on the Internet aren't really the most reliable things. Can anyone cite any evidence?
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by sievebrain on Sunday June 24, 2018 @04:53AM (#17385664)
Probably because you're asking people to Google stuff for you? It's all public.

There are two women. One posted on Twitter the next day boasting about the awesome night she'd had with Assange. She later deleted the post but others had recorded it already. The other woman sent lots of text messages saying she wasn't raped and only reported Assange because she wanted him to take an std test, that the police had blown it up and seemed to want to get him.

http://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2016-12-07/julian-assange-goes...

Moreover the women only filed these charges after they met each other and realised they'd both slept with him.

Look, I don't know why you're being so skeptical about this. False reports of rape are extremely common. Most credible studies I've seen peg it at 50% or higher. You should never take such an accusation at face value before a case has been won and in this case we don't even need a trial - the women both created documentary evidence they were lying and one even attempted to destroy it.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by forapurpose on Sunday June 24, 2018 @11:15AM (#17386843)
> Probably because you're asking people to Google stuff for you? It's all public.

The burden of proof is on the commenter posting the claims.

The article linked in the parent merely is a description of Assange's own statement, his side of the story, which certainly has no more credibility than the alleged victim and the legal authority. For example, regarding Assange's claims about text messages, the article makes a point of saying, "The ABC has not seen the text messages."

> the women both created documentary evidence they were lying and one even attempted to destroy it.

Again, any credible evidence? Surely this story would be in the NY Times and other major publications.

> False reports of rape are extremely common. Most credible studies I've seen peg it at 50% or higher.

I don't agree and I've never heard of such a study. We also are not talking about 'reports' by alleged victims, but an indictment by legal authorities after they examined the evidence. Again, perhaps the parent can provide some the evidence they say they've seen supporting this extraordinary claim about rape accusations, because false claims on the Internet are certainly even more common.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by superflyguy on Tuesday June 26, 2018 @04:57AM (#17398913)
"The burden of proof is on the commenter posting the claims."

The burden of the person who wants to learn rather than argue is to do research for themselves. I don't care whether you believe me or not - I mean, why would I?

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by superflyguy on Saturday June 23, 2018 @06:53AM (#17380575)
I'm not talking about hypothetical rape allegations. I'm talking about the Assange rape allegations. Educate yourself about the subject before just talking about it otherwise what's the point?
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by reaperducer on Friday June 22, 2018 @06:27PM (#17378011)
>It almost seems like the pornography charges against him was a way to punish him but without prosecuting him for the actual leakage

It's the new "tax evasion."

Ref: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Al_Capone#Tax_evasion

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by travmatt on Friday June 22, 2018 @07:32PM (#17378409)
Counterintelligence investigations and prosecutions probably take a long time, and the stakes are high enough that prosecutors want to make their case airtight. Charging him with the other crimes he’s believed guilty of is probably a good way of laying the groundwork for the later case, with the added bonus of greater leverage and hurting their financial (and therefore, legal) positions.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by dexterdog on Friday June 22, 2018 @05:32PM (#17377562)
And you can color me skeptical of any evidence that the government provided in that case.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by allthenews on Saturday June 23, 2018 @05:28AM (#17380368)
I bet they could have planet d the CP to gain access to his hardware, without which they would have had no legally obtained evidence of his crime. Apparently he was running some sort of server, but I haven't read past that.
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by Cacti on Friday June 22, 2018 @05:42PM (#17377649)
You should read the indictment. That porn was not planted.

https://www.scribd.com/document/379346745/Joshua-Adam-Schult...

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by LMYahooTFY on Friday June 22, 2018 @06:14PM (#17377932)
I read the indictment, but I don't see how you can be certain it was not planted.

He apparently saved IRC logs of their entire quest to obtain child porn....?

Using his name as a handle?

Impossible? No, but do you really think this is not questionable at all?

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by Cacti on Friday June 22, 2018 @06:30PM (#17378025)
Did you read the part about the VM he was (allegedly) hiding?
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by zeth___ on Friday June 22, 2018 @06:49PM (#17378175)
"Yes your honour, we totally found this."

"No your honour, we lost the evidence since then."

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by Cacti on Friday June 22, 2018 @07:15PM (#17378318)
Do you actually have an argument as to how they would fake the VM in a manner that would withstand the analysis of the defendants experts?
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by valuearb on Saturday June 23, 2018 @01:25AM (#17379686)
Can't the CIA hide trojans on unused sectors of storage that can't be detected by any known anti virus program?

You don't think they can't fake a VM?

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by djsumdog on Friday June 22, 2018 @06:08PM (#17377883)
eh, you should still be skeptical. This is a CIA contractor/employee we're talking about here. Child pornography is an interesting situation because no one outside of the justice department and a few key people can even legally examine the evidence.

It shouldn't be beyond the realm of believeability to this bad actors created these charges in retaliation.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by cortesoft on Friday June 22, 2018 @06:10PM (#17377900)
How would an indictment prove or disprove whether it was planted?
[dead]
Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by chiefalchemist on Friday June 22, 2018 @07:05PM (#17378254)
Believing he was is believable. But it's only a symptom.

Believing the intelligence community never bends the rules is the problem. That belief is the root disease.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by zeth___ on Saturday June 23, 2018 @01:58AM (#17379769)
Which do you think is more likely:

1). A person willing to risk their life for what they believe is right is a pedophile.

2). The CIA plants evidence.

After having a look at the things we know the CIA did during my life time, Iran-Contra, I'd say 2 is vastly more likely than 1.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by ben_w on Saturday June 23, 2018 @06:12AM (#17380478)
Despite being certain of 2, I am also certain that they don’t need to plant evidence to make someone’s life hell.

Their omniscient surveillance, combined with how many overlapping laws eveyone seems to have, means all they need to do is enumerate the crimes of someone they don’t like and run with it. So, for example, this particular enemy of theirs likes illegal porn? Next one will have something else.

This isn’t to say the CIA definitely didn’t plant anything, just that I think doing so is not the only option they will consider sufficient for their desired result.

Moral outrage based attacks have happened before; I’m told the FBI’s poison-pen-letter to MLK was being truthful when it claimed that he was adulterous, for example. While the idea that adultary could have such an impact is alien to me, the fact that it was attempted means the FBI thought otherwise at the time.

As for option 1? There’s a reason why we cant find them before they break the law. Whatever that reason is, it has to be compatible with someone like that being willing to do something like this.

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by chiefalchemist on Saturday June 23, 2018 @06:56AM (#17380587)
What I know is irrelevant. What matters is the general understanding and comprehension of the masses. If you accept Twitter and Facebook as an acceptable representation of the public at large then it's clear there are __a lot__ of naive / misled people.

Long to short, the majority would rather believe in the integrity of the intelligence community than the IC's willingness to take any road necessary (not just the high moral road).

Re:New Charges in Huge C.I.A. Breach Known as Vault 7 by saas_co_de on Friday June 22, 2018 @06:55PM (#17378209)
"In or about 2016" ... sounds like some pretty solid evidence they have there.