Things I Learned in the Gulag

Re:Things I Learned in the Gulag by Fins on Wednesday June 13, 2018 @02:30AM (#17300745)

While it did get quite a it better after Stalin's death, in a sense that people wouldn't keep an "emergency bag" of things one could take to prison by the bedside, with pretty much everyone knowing someone who had passed through the Gulag, a lot of Gulag has been internalized in the populace. The evil was very much banal, as it were, and the changes were mostly a matter of degree. Being seen reading "Kolyma Stories" would have you spending a few years on the "Sunny Kolyma" as it was called.

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Re:Things I Learned in the Gulag by ptaipale on Wednesday June 13, 2018 @04:12AM (#17301237)

I find it odd that someone downvotes your comment. It's not snarky, or trivial, it just states an opinion. It appears someone doesn't like the opinion.

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Re:Things I Learned in the Gulag by pvg on Wednesday June 13, 2018 @04:28AM (#17301294)

It happens. It will almost certainly sort itself out in a few hours, though.

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Re:Things I Learned in the Gulag by pvg on Wednesday June 13, 2018 @04:23AM (#17301272)

a lot of Gulag has been internalized in the populace.

Ah, exactly - I don't think that's why it continued to work. Consider, for example, how quickly and effectively the system replicated itself all over Eastern Europe. Those places had their bloody coups and brief periods of Stalinist terror but nothing of the Soviet scale and duration. Many avoided outright forced collectivization, a few didn't even require a permanent occupying Soviet army. And it still worked.

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Re:Things I Learned in the Gulag by Fins on Wednesday June 13, 2018 @04:16PM (#17306569)

Ah, but was it really that effective? Sure, Eastern European countries stayed within the Soviet sphere (Hungary in 1956 and Czechoslovakia in 1968 showed what happens if you don't) but they split at the earliest opportunity. While Russia is backtracking if not to communism than to glorification of USSR and Stalin.

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Re:Things I Learned in the Gulag by pvg on Wednesday June 13, 2018 @05:25PM (#17307088)

It was enormously effective. Forty years, in half a dozen countries. Forty years in which the rest of the world saw the Wirtschaftswunder from the ashes of Western Europe and Japan, decolonialization, the end of legally mandated racism in the US (on top of its own post-war economic and population boom). We got party meetings and retransmissions of Vremya on Friday nights. It still worked without anyone (statistically) going to the Kolyma, sunny or otherwise, without the voronki roaming the streets every night.

Even if we can't agree how or why, it's on us to always think about it in the hope it might in some small way prevent it from happening again. In the places that we left or the places we came to.

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Re:Things I Learned in the Gulag by Fins on Thursday June 14, 2018 @01:33AM (#17309537)

It lasted as long as Soviet troops were stationed nearby and ready to roll in at a moment's notice. As soon as it became clear that they wouldn't, the Wall fell, and the rest followed. In most places even relatively bloodlessly.

And because you didn't have the Big Terror to the same extent, life in Eastern Europe was quite a bit better than in the USSR. When we visited a friend in Prague in 1985, he had a collection of "anti-soviet" literature (including Kolyma Stories that would be enough to send anyone in USSR reliving Shalamov's experience. And he didn't even hide it...

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