News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Why I’m quitting GMO research by gus_massa on Wednesday March 28, 2018 @10:03PM (#16703983)
A natural nutation may be dangerous. For example the difference between the sweet and bitter almonds is a single gen. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Almond#Sweet_and_bitter_almond...

In particular:

> The acute oral lethal dose of cyanide for adult humans is reported to be 0.5–3.5 mg/kg (0.2–1.6 mg/lb) of body weight (approximately 50 bitter almonds), whereas for children, consuming 5–10 bitter almonds may be fatal.

The mutation that makes the bitter almonds produce cyanide is very old, totally natural and dangerous. It was mutated at least 300 million yeas ago, before the almond became a different plant than peach and cherry and other similar plants. Probably to make the animals avoid the plant and kernels.

Re:Why I’m quitting GMO research by reidacdc on Thursday March 29, 2018 @02:06PM (#16709410)
This is interesting, and a good point, but the existence of harmful natural mutations isn't by itself a refutation.

The idea I have (again, perhaps wrongly) is approximately that harmful-to-humans mutations make up a smaller fraction of the space of viable (i.e. allows the organism to survive at all) natural mutations, and a larger fraction of the space of viable transgenic mutations. A secondary point is that this is because the space of viable transgenic mutations is not constrained by the prior state of the genome, the same thing that makes transgenic mutations powerful also makes them risky.

So, I am (or I was, anyways) positing _fewer_ dangerous natural mutations, not necessarily zero.

I'm certainly less convinced that there's an important difference than I was yesterday, though, but mostly because the _accessible_ space of transgenic behaviors is evidently limited by investigator effort, which does not scale, so even if the _theoretical_ space is larger, it doesn't matter, we're not going to sample it.

Re:Why I’m quitting GMO research by sampo on Wednesday March 28, 2018 @11:15PM (#16704254)
> It was mutated at least 300 million yeas ago

I don't know, the whole group of flowering plants is about 300 million years old (says Wikipedia). Perhaps you mean 30 million years.

Re:Why I’m quitting GMO research by gus_massa on Wednesday March 28, 2018 @11:35PM (#16704324)
I got the number from http://amsdottorato.unibo.it/3843/1/Cervellati_Claudia_tesi.... (in the abstract) that cites https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11101-006-9033-1

Apparently is a very very old feature (even older than what I though).

Re:Why I’m quitting GMO research by sampo on Thursday March 29, 2018 @12:02AM (#16704418)
Ah, ok. Yes, the last paragraph on page 1 says that the feature appeared before flowering plants, conifers and ferns split up. So yes, it is very ancient. Thank you.
Re:Why I’m quitting GMO research by gus_massa on Thursday March 29, 2018 @09:19AM (#16706738)
I expect a more recent mutation to make the kernels more toxic than the edible part of the fruit, but I couldn't find an article that discuss that.