News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by wizardforhire on Monday March 26, 2018 @09:38PM (#16684413)
I've been putting off posting this for months because when I write it, it seems grandiose but it's been my life and it's too ridiculous not to share.

I was born in 80 so that dates me. I've worked in music for the last 20 years and I've worked with over 60 bands most of whom are very successful now. However that number is misleading because I've toured with hundreds of bands if you count the openers and headliners over the years. It's stupid really when I look back on it. Once when I was 25 I used my network to start a music festival with no money that's been going on for the last 10 years and has never had less than 50k people attend. Anyways long story short most people don't understand marketing. But when you're touring you're living it. I remember when the words taste maker started getting thrown around. I remember when gorilla marketing became a thing... Because the marketing people would all be coming to our shows and our parties and sponsoring us. All of this to say that

We were early adopters of Friendster, when they killed the bulletin board my friends and I moved to MySpace, when MySpace got over crowded we moved to Facebook, when our families friends got on Facebook we left for Twitter and reddit, the less public of us left Twitter almost immediately but our pr teams stayed, when Obama won in 08 we left reddit. Many of us went to snapchat and we all use Instagram even though we hate it. There was a minor period when we thought google + was going to serve us but that lasted exactly one day.

What we desperately want is a decentralized encrypted locally hosted application that has exactly one killer simple feature. A bulletin board to post events. That's it. A simple way to keep in touch with each other and local ownership of our photos and videos. Sure to reduce bandwidth we'd be fine with our friends or fans hosting encrypted files on their devices but that's as far as they go. Do that, slap an easy to use interface on it, don't have advertising call it something literal like friends torrent or something and we'll never have another Facebook. If you want to monotize it... Give it a market place. But if you take anything from this rant it should be this, your tastemakers aren't faceless nameless statistics they're real people and they're friends with each other. We know who we are and we are and have been paying attention.

Also fuck Facebook freedom isn't free

Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by reitanqild on Tuesday March 27, 2018 @03:08AM (#16686011)
> What we desperately want is a decentralized encrypted locally hosted application that has exactly one killer simple feature. A bulletin board to post events. That's it. A simple way to keep in touch with each other and local ownership of our photos and videos. Sure to reduce bandwidth we'd be fine with our friends or fans hosting encrypted files on their devices but that's as far as they go. Do that, slap an easy to use interface on it, don't have advertising call it something literal like friends torrent or something and we'll never have another Facebook. If you want to monotize it... Give it a market place.

I guess someone here should accept this challenge.

Is there a way to inform you when someone think they have an acceptable solution?

Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by firmgently on Tuesday March 27, 2018 @03:29AM (#16686150)
Facebook's popularity is driven by that tic of just wanting to have a quick look to see what friends/family are up to, then getting stuck there because of addiction/manipulative techniques.

I can't see people feeling the same way about a site which is only about events, it's a different impulse... almost like tuning in to an adverts-only station. Nobody is on FB because of bands - although they're happy to find out what bands are up to when they happen to already be on the site (not knocking bands as a thing - the same applies to eg. my art page).

Some might say "it doesn't matter, it doesn't have to be as popular as FB" but at that point then why not just have a website?

Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by michaelchisari on Monday March 26, 2018 @09:47PM (#16684449)
Do that, slap an easy to use interface on it

What you're asking for is much more difficult than you realize.

Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by wizardforhire on Monday March 26, 2018 @09:56PM (#16684499)
I know (with lots love)! That's why I haven't built it. It's also why I don't think it has been built yet and why in my frustration this evening I sort of let loose.
Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by ultimape on Wednesday April 04, 2018 @01:00PM (#16756632)
"But if you take anything from this rant it should be this, your taste makers aren't faceless nameless statistics they're real people and they're friends with each other. We know who we are and we are and have been paying attention."

This is why vendors such as Facebook etc. try so had to get their product to be installed on phones (and in a previous generation, cut deals with PC manufactures to be one of the crap-wares installed in their OS image). If they can't get in thru the front door, they aim for the side door or maintenance entrance.

If I could root my phone, Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter, would be the first things properly removed and not simply "disabled".

Indecently, I'm in the market for a rootable phone with a Samsung Note style digitizer support.

The infection runs deep.

Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by brandmeyer on Monday March 26, 2018 @10:08PM (#16684567)
> What we desperately want is a decentralized encrypted locally hosted application ... we'd be fine with our friends or fans hosting encrypted files on their devices but that's as far as they go.

What exactly are you trying to get out of encryption in this MinimalBook application of yours?

Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by wizardforhire on Monday March 26, 2018 @10:30PM (#16684672)
Privacy, security, rights Managment. Not quite State level but close (because does that even exist?). It's celebrities that travel nearly most days of the years. Every place that's always in the news for something terrible is probably a destination at somepoint. Also stalkers, extortionists, kidnappers, they're very real. Also and I would think probably more pertinent is that given current events, for something decentralized to take off and for content to be shared semi-locally amongst a partially trusted network it would have to be encrypted with some pretty large keys for it to pass the muster of the initial user base. A lot of these people had their nudes stolen from iCloud for instance. Granted a lot of that was fishing but still if it's going to be adopted people want encryption. It'd probably be smart to put in really big language at the time of install a general introduction to best security practices... And if you really want to be compassionate to the users and little notifier whose nuisance level could be dialed down that periodically reminds them.
Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by brandmeyer on Tuesday March 27, 2018 @12:29AM (#16685255)
Here's the thing. Encryption only allows you to protect the channel of information between two parties. Once the other party has the information you shared, they can in turn share it with whomever they wish. You can establish a private network amongst your selected peers.

But you cannot prevent your peers from violating the network's privacy, either purposefully or accidentally. No amount of encryption can do that.

Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by wizardforhire on Tuesday March 27, 2018 @01:54AM (#16685660)
Right. But I'm thinking torrents and packets distributed to the local network of peers to ease the distributed bandwidth load. Granted a state level actor could potentially collect all data as they do now and have a hell of time trying to piece it all back together. That would take total knowledge of the network and the keys. But for users whom have permission to view the content granted to them through the "friending" process the last thing you want is for them to be able to mine their device or know what's being stored on their device. This would take a fixed install size with a flexible disc space to store popular files, something that would be clearly communicated at the time install of course. Nothing will stop people from pulling triggers other than culture. But making it difficult for the bad actors to do so seems like a good place to start. That and having a paper trail should shit hit the fan.
Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by reitanqild on Tuesday March 27, 2018 @03:15AM (#16686057)
> But for users whom have permission to view the content granted to them through the "friending" process the last thing you want is for them to be able to mine their device or know what's being stored on their device.

I assume them is a reference to state level actor? At least to me it is not immediately obvious and I think I misread it the first time.

Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by loup-vaillant on Tuesday March 27, 2018 @04:21AM (#16686405)
Looks like wizardforhire was talking about something like distributed encrypted backups. The simple version is, others store your stuff for you (and you store theirs), but they can't read it, because only you have the key.

Add to that a way to authorise people to decrypt your stuff (and, ideally, ways to revoke those rights), and you get the the whole thing.

Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by wizardforhire on Tuesday March 27, 2018 @01:31PM (#16690817)
This is exactly what I was attempting to convey.
Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by reitanqild on Wednesday March 28, 2018 @01:51PM (#16700032)
Distributed backup already exists and can possibly work.

But IIReadC you wanted to cache media on peers devices to allow them to see/listen to it.

That cannot work unless you trust your friends completely (or keep your friends under constant surveillance, and hardly even then) as once they see it on their screen they can photograph or record your media, if necessary using an external device (e.g. a camera) and store it or share it.

Also, once your friends has access to it that makes your friends a target for bad actors that might want to trick or coerce your friends into sharing.

Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by brandmeyer on Tuesday March 27, 2018 @11:29AM (#16689430)
> But for users whom have permission to view the content granted to them through the "friending" process the last thing you want is for them to be able to mine their device or know what's being stored on their device.

This is just another form of digital restrictions management (aka DRM). I think you'll find that most of the engineers that are opposed in principle to the gov-tech surveillance complex are also opposed in principle to DRM.

It is at least possible to build an open-source distributed social networking application that gives you most of the features you described, and in particular, will make it impractical to vacuum up whole social network graphs.

But at some point, ordinary netizens are going to have to learn some basic information theory. Just as commando clubbing is going to lead to some paparazzi getting vagina pics, nude selfies are going to get out beyond your ability to control.

Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by wizardforhire on Tuesday March 27, 2018 @01:42PM (#16690938)
Fair enough. I hate drm also.
Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by tomcam on Tuesday March 27, 2018 @03:53AM (#16686275)
>It's celebrities that travel nearly most days of the years. Every place that's always in the news for something terrible is probably a destination at somepoint.

Given that market, why not charge for MinimalBook as a premium experience instead of postulating an ill-defined “marketplace”?

Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by sriku on Tuesday March 27, 2018 @04:15AM (#16686371)
Secure Scuttlebutt (Patchwork application), I think, has its heart in the right place.

http://scuttlebot.io/

Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by chestervonwinch on Monday March 26, 2018 @10:34PM (#16684690)
Have you looked at secure scuttlebutt with patchwork?
Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by EGreg on Monday March 26, 2018 @11:12PM (#16684891)
Sounds like you want the Qbix Platform

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pZ1O_gmPneI

Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by jdeisenberg on Tuesday March 27, 2018 @12:04AM (#16685131)
Alas, the web site (https://qbix.com/people) appears not to work on Firefox Developer Edition 60.0: “Unable to init adapter. App config is not defined.”
Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by flukus on Tuesday March 27, 2018 @03:16AM (#16686064)
> What we desperately want is a decentralized encrypted locally hosted application that has exactly one killer simple feature. A bulletin board to post events. That's it. A simple way to keep in touch with each other and local ownership of our photos and videos.

Can't you do this with a mailing list? That handles the notification. A big standard website can do the rest like hosting photos.

Re:Facebook has lost $100B in 10 days and now advertisers ar... by goocy on Tuesday March 27, 2018 @04:29AM (#16686427)
Have you looked into ZeroNet? https://zeronet.io/

Seems to do what you need.