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Re:Lead is even deadlier than was feared by amelius on Sunday March 18, 2018 @08:38AM (#16611668)
What is still a safe lead blood value?

And is there any merit in "chelation" therapies, as advocated on health websites, like this one, [1]?

[1] https://www.livestrong.com/article/199912-what-natural-herbs...

Re:Lead is even deadlier than was feared by arkades on Sunday March 18, 2018 @09:13AM (#16611791)
There is not, insofar as lead tends to be either inspired or ingested in contaminated water. For most people, it's the former. The "oral chelators" just bind lead that is mixed in with them, stopping you from absorbing as much of it. That is, Senapati 2001 (the garlic-rat study) didn't give lead acetate in the morning and garlic in the afternoon; they intentionally mixed the two together.

That is, oral intake of lead with oral intake of garlic, means maybe you shit out more lead with the garlic chelation agent. But lots of garlic will do nothing for water you drink later in the day, or the air passing into your lungs.

There may be some additional anti-oxidant activity. Anti-oxidants are good for you across the board. Have at them.

As to a safe blood lead level: depending on your local public health department, 5 mcg/dL will or should prompt public health action. <5mcg will usually prompt a doctor to start trying to figure out where you're exposed, and cut that exposure out. >5mcg turns into a little bit of a grey area depending on where you are, and by 10mcg your kid is getting chelation therapy. These numbers are built around children, not adults, because they're far more susceptible to the adverse effects of lead exposure.

That said, we have not identified any safe lead level - every level that has been tested has been shown to be associated with some sort of negative cognitive developmental impact (Lanphear 2000). I feel comfortable saying the safe level is "0", but that's not medical consensus, that's just my opinion.

Re:Lead is even deadlier than was feared by wonthegame on Sunday March 18, 2018 @09:30AM (#16611837)
Just adding to your comment. Govt regulation for lead workers where I worked was about 1.4 micro mols of lead.
Re:Lead is even deadlier than was feared by 2chen on Sunday March 18, 2018 @12:10PM (#16612596)
Which is just an arbitrary number the government came up with because zero is obviously unreasonable for lead workers..
Re:Lead is even deadlier than was feared by imcoconut on Sunday March 18, 2018 @02:46PM (#16613526)
There is merit to chelation therapy as a means of eliminating mercury (and other heavy metals including lead) stored in the body, but many protocols, both alternative and conventional, don't consider the full complexities involved and can be more harmful than beneficial.

There are a number of relevant factors including length of exposures (acute or chronic poisoning) and form of metal (organic, inorganic, metallic - for mercury at least).

By far the best source I found on the topic is Andrew Cutler, a chemistry PhD from Princeton who was mercury poisoned himself and created an effective and safe protocol for removal. He has a strong background in kinetics, pharmacokinetics, and biochemistry in general, and recognized that the standard toxicological protocols for heavy metal treatment were very dangerous (e.g. infrequent high dose IV administrations of DMPS/DMSA) , especially for cases of chronic poisoning.

According to Cutler, protocols such as the one you linked are very dangerous as they don't administer the chelating agent according to its metabolic half-life in the body (the half-lives of the chelating agents in cilantro and chlorella are unknown). As a result blood levels of the chelating agent and the metals fluctuate greatly. This can mobilize previously sequestered metals, but not provide the body enough time to properly eliminate them, which results in "re-poisoning" events. And when a large amount fat-loving free metals are released by the chelating agents within a short period of time, they often enter the central nervous system, settle there and exacerbate neurological symptoms.

I have no background in chemistry, so that's my summary of what I've read. But I highly recommend his book [1] which focuses mostly on mercury, but he covers lead as well. There are a few interviews with him around the web as well [2]. Also happy to provide more info and sources as I have two of his books and they both cite a wide array of sources.

[1] http://www.noamalgam.com/

[2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8AQGrh0XMw&t=34s

Re:Lead is even deadlier than was feared by amelius on Sunday March 18, 2018 @05:38PM (#16614545)
Hi, thanks, I know it's well-intended, but I can't find Cutler's work on PubMed, so I'm still wondering how legitimate this work is.
Re:Lead is even deadlier than was feared by imcoconut on Monday March 19, 2018 @07:13PM (#16624266)
As I understand it, pubmed (and medline) only index a subset of medical research, and excludes most non-medical science research. As Cutler was a chemist, I'm not sure any articles of his would be indexed by pubmed.

Scopus, which seems to be run by Elsevier, lists some abstracts and letters here (I have no idea how extensive this is) [1]

[1] https://www.scopus.com/authid/detail.uri?authorId=7103370042

Re:Lead is even deadlier than was feared by manmal on Sunday March 18, 2018 @12:08PM (#16612586)
Here is a small list of chelation agents hosted by the WHO: http://www.who.int/selection_medicines/committees/expert/18/...

I guess chelation/elimination does work if the WHO writes about it.

AFAIK lead is also stored in bones and probably within body tissues, so this might take a while.