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Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by HenryBemis on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:06PM (#16190291)
In a negative connotation: because insurance companies and hospital owners are taking you for a ride and politicians sit back, sipping their whiskeys and enjoy their lobbying. And if anyone DARES to make such comparisons to Sweden or Finland, some republican will start yelling "down with socialism!!!". One day USA's citizens will "have enough of this" and perhaps do something about this, but this day is anything but close.
Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by dang on Friday January 19, 2018 @09:49PM (#16191780)
Would you please not post ideological rants to Hacker News? These things invariably turn into low-quality discussions and/or flamewars, dragging down the quality of the site. You don't have to change your views to post here, but you do need to post civilly and thoughtfully, rather than in rant/battle mode.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by plehoux on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:13PM (#16190346)
Quebec, Canada == free + 1 year maternity leave at 75% of your salary + a lot $$ by both Quebec province and federal governments.
Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by koolba on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:16PM (#16190377)
Who pays the 75% salary when you're not working? Does it come from the company you were employed at, the government, or some combo?
Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by LeifCarrotson on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:37PM (#16190550)
You do, through taxes, but would you rather pay lower taxes for fewer benefits and more aircraft carriers in the US, or more taxes for huge benefits like maternity leave and education?
Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by koolba on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:54PM (#16190699)
Speaking selfishly, I can’t get pregnant and primary education is primarily funded by local property taxes so I’m for the lower overall taxes.
Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by Voloskaya on Friday January 19, 2018 @06:02PM (#16190757)
In most countries where there is paid maternity leave, there is also government pension for retirement that is founded by the active population.

So everyone benefits from people having kids, even if it's not your kid, because in the end you need them to pay for your pension.

Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by toomuchtodo on Friday January 19, 2018 @06:39PM (#16190968)
That’s the crux of the problem. If you speak selfishly without looking at the big picture, you can’t make a rational decision at scale.
Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by koolba on Friday January 19, 2018 @07:01PM (#16191074)
The decisions are still rational, we're just optimizing a different variable. In my view the majority of the money I give the government gets squandered and I have no realistic expectation of getting back anything close to what I've contributed to social security.

By that standard if someone suggests raising taxes further to increase the amount of money in the equation I'd be firmly against it. The problem with our government is that it doesn't collect enough taxes, it's that it doesn't spend the money it collects wisely.

We're getting off topic from the original article though. If this was a conversation about something like a single payer system it'd be apt (and I'd be for it as well!) but (chronically underfunded) pensions are an entirely separate topic.

Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by rektide on Friday January 19, 2018 @08:15PM (#16191432)
I'd think most people would realize that having a society raised by loving, caring, well-adapted parents would pay off in the long run. I certainly think it would be in my best interest to have my future fellow peers raised well.

Now, maybe you REALLY want to stare into the void and declare that the decisions made now won't affect your life, won't change your peers. I guess that's your right, but that's not how my societal calculus functions. To me, this is a bargain for maintaining an upright, well functioning, positive society.

Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by koolba on Friday January 19, 2018 @08:42PM (#16191540)
So why stop at 75% for maternity leave? Why not 100%? Or even 200% of your original salary? It’s for families and kids right? Why not double subsidize it?

You claim it’s a bargain. At what tax rate is it a bargain? 5% increased tax rate? 10%? 25%? 50%?

Specifics matter. Make your case with an actual proposal. Claiming I’m heartless because I don’t want others to spend my money is hardly an argument.

Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by Voloskaya on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:24PM (#16190438)
The government only (at least in Québec).
Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by maehwasu on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:36PM (#16190542)
Aka the other Canadian provinces.
Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by Voloskaya on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:50PM (#16190670)
QPIP is deducted directly from Québec's employees salary at the source, so no, not in this case :)
Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by odammit on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:21PM (#16190412)
Do you know any coyotes that can smuggle Californians in?
Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by forgot-my-pw on Friday January 19, 2018 @06:30PM (#16190919)
Ask the moose
Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by corpMaverick on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:36PM (#16190544)
We are going to build a beautiful wall.

More seriously. I am hopeful that a single payer system or similar starts in California, or may be Massachusetts.

Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by odammit on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:47PM (#16190651)
I’ll have to get a boat then.

I’m lucky my wife has Kaiser through the CA school system so our kids will be cheap. It sucks for people that aren’t as lucky.

If we would have used my insurance we would have to spend a Honda Civic. Maybe even a pre-owned Accord.

Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by sanmon3186 on Friday January 19, 2018 @09:44PM (#16191756)
So what stops Americans who can’t afford, to cross the border for delivery or cheaper healthcare.
Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by PeptoKelpto on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:26PM (#16190454)
18 months now! :D
Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by riffraff on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:09PM (#16190311)
I think it's not just Sweden or Finland, most of Europe has socialized healthcare and birth is one of the things that come free.

AFAIU in general you pay for stuff like private rooms or such.

Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by Carioca on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:25PM (#16190446)
Germany and Switzerland have complicated systems where you are mandated to have insurance but the state provides you with insurance if you cannot afford it.
Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by jaclaz on Saturday January 20, 2018 @08:59AM (#16193340)
>I think it's not just Sweden or Finland, most of Europe has socialized healthcare and birth is one of the things that come free. AFAIU in general you pay for stuff like private rooms or such.

I can confirm this is the case for both Italy and Spain.

But I have to say that sometimes, even if the National Health Service does provide for free[1] a given cure or analysis (or assistance to birth), in some cases they may be not fast enough (not for the actual delivery, but for some exams/tests) and there are private services (hospitals, diagnostic clinics, etc.) where sometimes you need to go, paying out cash (or - it is now becoming more common - having a dedicated insurance).

In my experience these - though not actually "cheap" - are anyway a fraction of the costs they I have seen mentioned about the US.

While the average income in Italy and Spain is lower than the US, the cost of these services is proportionally much, much lower.

A problem - common enough - has been in recent years the increase in the number of Ceasarian sections, even when there wasn't any need for it, allegedly (but it has not been actually proven) to increase the reimburse to the hospital by the NHS (SSN in italian) or by the insurance company, or to limit the legal responsibility of the doctor in case of complications.

[1] Actually almost for free, there is a complicated system where depending on your income level you may pay a part of the cost.

Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by HenryBemis on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:46PM (#16190643)
I used Finland and Sweden as they have dreamy metrics on everything-healthcare, but I understand that taxes are sky-high. In these countries I consider taxes to be an "investment" and when you need the State, then the State is there FOR YOU, and doesn't throw you under the bus in a time of need.

In some other European countries (e.g. the PIIGS) with the budget cuts, all social care/benefits have worsened dramatically.

Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by stevekemp on Saturday January 20, 2018 @10:42AM (#16193713)
I moved to Finland a while back. Taxes are indeed sky-high, but at the same time I can see that they're being used.

Streets are clean, local transport works (busses, trams, local-trains), education is world-leading, healthcare is great, etc, etc.

I'm sure there are people scamming money off the top, corruption is universal, but I can't begrudge paying taxes when the country seems to be so well run.

(I'm a foreigner, I suspect I wouldn't know if it were badly run!)

Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by natecavanaugh on Friday January 19, 2018 @07:15PM (#16191146)
This has given me a lot to think about, because I have felt like I've been on both sides of the line, but, I have of course because it's suited me when I need it.

I feel like government is still not the right institution to make purchasing decisions, but until we make one, it's unbeatable.

But, this might also be cultural. People who come to the US are usually willing to take high risks and carry with that a certain sense of irritation with those who don't, and I feel like that might be where a lot of our national culture carries with it this sort of perspective.

I could of course be super wrong, but I think if we could erase the concept of "fairness" in this area, we might make more progress in actually helping real people with real problems

Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by senorjazz on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:30PM (#16190488)
Can confirm, wife had an emergency c section in the UK, cost $0
Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by wil421 on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:42PM (#16190598)
Why does the UK still have private insurance? I had a long conversation with a colleague in London but I couldn’t grasp the use case.
Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by ethnicify on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:51PM (#16190678)
For non-national-health-service private care.

For the rich, basically. NHS is free, but has its issues with inconsistent service and long(!) wait times.

Private is hit and miss, but significantly faster and significantly(!) more expensive. Hence the insurance.

Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by tyingq on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:27PM (#16190464)
I think that's some of it, but there's probably other causes too. Like malpractice risk driving certain decisions about care and US specific cultural expectations around the role of nurses or midwives, pain management, etc.
Re:The US is the most expensive nation in which to have a baby by guelo on Friday January 19, 2018 @05:53PM (#16190696)
> One day USA's citizens will "have enough of this"

Won't happen because a big portion of the middle class doesn't experience these problems so they just shrug it off and see it as only a problem for "those" people.