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Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by frgtpsswrdlame on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @12:29PM (#15551541)
Sources said that HR department representatives told staff in one office they were being let go due to problematic "conduct with peers." When questioned, an ex-employee said, HR declined to specify any details about the alleged poor conduct, which had never been previously discussed.

<tin foil hat> Is this pre-empting a union push?

Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by MikeTheGreat on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @12:40PM (#15551649)
I remember a while back some .com company laid off a bunch of their employees (more than 40%? 50%?). Firing that many people at once triggered a set of 'lay off' laws, which required certain behavior from the company (such as giving the employees X days notice, etc, etc).

This is pure speculation, but I wonder if Telsa is trying to do last-minute layoffs while avoiding whatever 'lay off laws' there are by claiming that each individual is totally being fired for totally legit individual reasons, for sure, yep.

Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by archildress on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @12:43PM (#15551668)
The provision you're referring to is called a WARN notice. Employers with 100 or more employees typically are required to give 60 days notice.
Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by gozur88 on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @02:26PM (#15552718)
Companies don't fire for cause very much. It's just asking for a wrongful termination lawsuit.
Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by sjg007 on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @01:41PM (#15552216)
The Department of Labor usually investigates these things.
Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by brewdad on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @02:02PM (#15552443)
This is not your father's Department of Labor. I see little chance that any enforcement will happen.
Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by jerf on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @12:36PM (#15551610)
"Is this pre-empting a union push?"

Honest clarification request: Do you to suggest/worry that they are classifying "agitating for a union" as problematic "conduct with peers"?

(If so, I expect we'll hear if that's the case soon, with a chance of hearing that even if it's not the case. That is a storyline the media would be salivating to run.)

Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by frgtpsswrdlame on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @12:55PM (#15551771)
Basically yes. Perhaps "problematic conduct with peers" is poor wording or maybe it refers to some harrassment crackdown or maybe it's due to financial problems, really it could be any number of things but because it's Tesla the union connection is what comes to mind. Regardless it's obvious they're firing people for something they don't want to be connected to and using 'performance' as a smoke screen.
Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by rhizome on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @12:43PM (#15551674)
Honest clarification request: Do you to suggest/worry that they are classifying "agitating for a union" as problematic "conduct with peers"?

That's the way I read it.

Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by gozur88 on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @02:27PM (#15552741)
That wouldn't make much sense, though. The last thing you'd want to do if you were trying to keep out a union is behave in a way your employees would see as tyrannical.
Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by corin_ on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @03:43PM (#15553419)
Well there's two opposite ways that have historically been tried to avoid unionisation - you can make sure employees are all happy enough not to want it, or make sure they're too scared of losing their jobs should they support it.
Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by Spooky23 on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @02:22PM (#15552668)
For cause terminated employees don’t get unemployment.

My guess is that since Musk companies don’t feel constrained by rules, they figure they’ll save money in UI taxes by forcing workers to adjudicate their UI benefits. They get the benefit of cooking their balance sheet as an additional benefit.

Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by aplusbi on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @04:30PM (#15553910)
>For cause terminated employees don’t get unemployment.

For the most part this isn't true - only intentional misconduct is grounds for not receiving unemployment.

Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by jmcgough on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @12:56PM (#15551779)
Tesla has been waging an internal war against union formation, so wouldn't surprise me if they were firing people they saw as pushing unionization.
Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by wbl on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @01:20PM (#15552012)
That's a surefire way to get hauled up before the NLRB. I'm not surprised companies try it, but they usually get sued for it.
Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by twoquestions on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @01:59PM (#15552407)
NLRB still exists? I honestly thought the new administration got rid of that.
Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by gowld on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @02:26PM (#15552734)
You don't think that would have been announced somewhere in the news, if it had happened?
Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by pktgen on Thursday October 26, 2017 @12:51AM (#15556433)
The NLRB already filed a complaint against Tesla recently: https://cdn.arstechnica.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/09/CPT.3....
Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by YurtleTheTurtle on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @12:35PM (#15551595)
No it's preempting going broke. Especially since Elon is one of the combined companies biggest creditors and has his own personal finances deeply entwined with that of the company. (See also Sears / Eddie Lampert)
Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by lafar6502 on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @12:56PM (#15551776)
Yep they got so much money for nothing and still prefer to rip off their people
Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by logfromblammo on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @12:43PM (#15551672)
It certainly is suspicious that people were fired "for performance reasons" when the company is unable or unwilling to provide the performance data that would support that assertion.

But, on the other hand, these employees were probably "at will", so the company does not need to give any reason, or even to publicly justify the firings in any way. So it could be that "performance" is the lie that they believe to damage ongoing recruiting efforts the least.

Or it could be that they have determined individual performance assessments to be useless in the face of the more objectively measurable department-wide performance numbers.

All I know for certain is that I won't be sending them any applications or resumes until they can elucidate their motives behind this.

The simplest explanation is that the company isn't making money and investors are getting antsy about bankruptcy.

Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by Spooky23 on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @02:24PM (#15552688)
You can fire people for any reason, but there are costs involved in laying people off.

HR is a cynical business. Requiring stuff like training your outsourced replacement is also a strategy here — the longer you hang on to “undead” employees, the more likelihood they will leave voluntarily.

Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by sjg007 on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @01:46PM (#15552263)
The company does have to prove that they didn't fire someone for a restricted reason and basically if there's any hint of that it is viewed poorly by the govt/courts.

I imagine a lot of lawyers will gear up here and there will be a lot of eDiscovery.

Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by YurtleTheTurtle on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @12:51PM (#15551738)
California is at will but they do have specific laws and procedures for mass firings and layoffs. I think Tesla is trying to skirt these by calling them performance related instead of layoffs. (And to protect their stock price from having to admit they can't afford all their workers.)
Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by dver on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @01:43PM (#15552239)
Your peers were here on weekends and you were not.
Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by chrisbennet on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @08:35PM (#15555474)
Your peers drank the coolaid an you did not.

“You make the rest of us look bad when you don’t donate your weekend to The Company. Wouldn’t you rather make Our Leader richer instead of being with your family?”

Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by Bartweiss on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @01:05PM (#15551860)
It doesn't seem impossible on the corporate side, but I'd be surprised if it was true and yet none of the newly-fired employees speaking anonymously to the media raised the point.
Re:Tesla's mass firings spread to SolarCity by whatok on Wednesday October 25, 2017 @12:32PM (#15551566)
Not clear as to whether those were SolarCity or Tesla (direct) employees.