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Re:Google's $19B Black Box Is Worrying Investors by psykotic on Tuesday October 10, 2017 @12:47PM (#15443260)
> It's rather sad that Google needs to pay Android makers a fee for installing it's apps, given how Google gives away source code that makes Android exist in the first place.

This is a very innocent view of Google's business practices in this area. Google has a tight hold over most device makers through anti-fragmentation agreements and other contracts if they want GMS and want early access to the non-public AOSP tree, which is a practical necessity to ship cutting-edge Android devices. Aside from hard legal power, Google also projects soft power through their control of the ecosystem and device makers wanting to maintain good relations. As a result, Android-derived innovation in the ecosystem is highly constrained even if AOSP is open source licensed since device makers and manufacturers cannot ship devices with Android-derived operating systems in device categories enumerated by the AFAs unless the devices pass CTS (which prevents most kinds of serious divergence from Android).

Re:Google's $19B Black Box Is Worrying Investors by mankash666 on Tuesday October 10, 2017 @01:03PM (#15443421)
You're free to run your own app store, like Amazon fire devices, and not subscribe to GMS. Why shouldn't Google get something in return for enabling phone makers with an OS and app store? They're a for profit company after all
Re:Google's $19B Black Box Is Worrying Investors by psykotic on Tuesday October 10, 2017 @01:26PM (#15443619)
Sure, and the AFA has a pro-developer and pro-consumer side by reducing fragmentation. But I think it's important to understand that the open source aspect of Android is a small part of the story in practice for device makers. The narrative that Google is just "giving it away for free" is naive at best for the very reason you state: they're a profit-driven megacorp.
Re:Google's $19B Black Box Is Worrying Investors by mankash666 on Tuesday October 10, 2017 @03:18PM (#15444558)
I'm not naive, but everyone takes the OS source code and platform for granted, and asks, "what else can I get"?

It's obvious that Android has enabled and continues to enable an ecosystem of hardware companies to thrive. These companies have tried repeatedly to build their own software, but with NO commercial success. Imagine a world with an Apple like Android, Google owning the software, closed sourced, walled, yada yada ... That's still a possibility if the ludicrous EU actions on Android don't stop. Google makes about 1/10th the revenue and 1/100th the profit off Android as Apple makes off the iOS product lines.

Android's ecosystem gets a LOT more out of Google than Google gets out of Android

EDIT: Samsung, LG, Huawei, ... they're even relevant in phones because of Google. I doubt it's the other way around. Samsung is SO scared of Google cutting it off that it tries repeatedly with alternate OS-es --> everything from Tizen to windows phones. Nothing sticks

Re:Google's $19B Black Box Is Worrying Investors by SXX on Tuesday October 10, 2017 @04:24PM (#15445042)
> That's still a possibility if the ludicrous EU actions on Android don't stop. Google makes about 1/10th the revenue and 1/100th the profit off Android as Apple makes off the iOS product lines.

Google doesn't need to make money off hardware or software, it's an ad company. Yeah sure they'll just go and remove themselves from mobile ads market because laughable penalties EU apply on them.

Re:Google's $19B Black Box Is Worrying Investors by mankash666 on Tuesday October 10, 2017 @04:52PM (#15445225)
FYI - the ad industry's future is uncertain, given the advent of ad-blockers & privacy laws. Selling phones with a proven OS, on the other hand, is a straightforward model.

If the EU's fines are laughable, I think the status quo will persist. But if Google is beholden to Apple & phone makers who use the very OS it provides & builds, cutting others off and owning the hardware isn't far fetched. Why do you think HTC was acquired?

Re:Google's $19B Black Box Is Worrying Investors by bitmapbrother on Tuesday October 10, 2017 @04:49PM (#15445211)
Can you name another OS that has had as many forks as Android?
Re:Google's $19B Black Box Is Worrying Investors by scholia on Tuesday October 10, 2017 @05:48PM (#15445602)
Unix ;-)
Re:Google's $19B Black Box Is Worrying Investors by bitmapbrother on Tuesday October 10, 2017 @09:29PM (#15446660)
The Chinese Android forks probably outnumber all of the Unix forks. Additionally, every version of Android, built an OEM, is a fork of Android.
Re:Google's $19B Black Box Is Worrying Investors by rayiner on Tuesday October 10, 2017 @05:52PM (#15445632)
Wouldn’t it be better to just sell a product in exchange for money, instead of all this backdoor stuff? Like the good old days of Symbian.