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Re:Alaska’s thawing soils are now pouring carbon dioxide int... by simonh on Wednesday August 23, 2017 @05:15PM (#15085262)
To be fair to us we are only just barely sentient.

In evolutionary terms we have literally only just managed to build a technological society. Therefore it stands to reason we only recently evolved sufficient intelligence to do so. Otherwise we'd have done it sooner. In the grand scheme of things we're on the very lowest bottom level of the sentience hierarchy.

Re:Alaska’s thawing soils are now pouring carbon dioxide int... by gooseus on Wednesday August 23, 2017 @06:08PM (#15085638)
That's fair, but it'll be sad to see our species added to the dustbin of history after squandering such a great opportunity to move from planetary to stellar civilization.

If there happen to be any other sentient species watching us, I can only assume they spend most of the time face-palming, head-shaking and eye-rolling.

Re:Alaska’s thawing soils are now pouring carbon dioxide int... by ams6110 on Wednesday August 23, 2017 @06:55PM (#15085916)
Maybe there aren't any. Maybe all sentient species self-destruct when they discover and start developing technology but don't understand all the implications. There's a theory along these lines that explains why we've never found any signs of extraterrestrial intelligent life.
Re:Alaska’s thawing soils are now pouring carbon dioxide int... by MoOmer on Wednesday August 23, 2017 @07:10PM (#15086015)
Re:Alaska’s thawing soils are now pouring carbon dioxide int... by ams6110 on Wednesday August 23, 2017 @08:17PM (#15086503)
Yes. I actually subscribe to the idea that local maxima at a lower level if sentience is much more common.

We'd probably still be a dinosaur-populated planet if not for a random asteroid.

Re:Alaska’s thawing soils are now pouring carbon dioxide int... by systemWizord on Thursday August 24, 2017 @03:46AM (#15088342)
In my humble opinion, antinatalism contributes much to it. Smartest people I know are strictly antinatalist, and it makes sense. What's the point of keeping a specie alive? The very product of universe's RNG? Life is mostly suffering as it is, inter-stellar life would probably be even worse.

I'm personally not invested in the environment-preservation fight at all.

Re:Alaska’s thawing soils are now pouring carbon dioxide int... by gooseus on Thursday August 24, 2017 @03:39PM (#15093322)
Maybe I'm an idiot, but I find antinatalist views to be small-minded, selfish and cowardly. In a vast universe of dead matter which tends toward equilibrium and decay there exists a process that tends toward complexity and order.

Life exists in this universe, it's a part it's nature and so is consciousness. Whether by design or by some random chance, it is self-evident that it exists. Not only that, you can find it adapted to the extremes of every environment it encounters.

Suffering is the engine of adaptation and everything we consider valuable has only come about through the immense suffering and sacrifice of those that have lived.

We, as conscious life, are the only known species which have the possibility to adapt to an environment outside of Earth. I believe, without any external spiritual input, that our responsibility is quite clear.

How much suffering is a function of the zero-sum game that is played in our (mostly) closed environment? Yes, expanding into space may increase the overall number of individuals suffering, but isn't it really suffering per capita that should be the measure?

Suffering isn't to be ignored and I believe seeking to reduce when possible is admirable and morally right... but to abdicate our responsibility to the process of life and allow it halt (which it will eventually on this planet)? Simply because some people feel bad about things sometimes? No, I'm not buying it for a second.

Re:Alaska’s thawing soils are now pouring carbon dioxide int... by systemWizord on Friday August 25, 2017 @12:19PM (#15099618)
Yes, I agree, you are an idiot. "We" don't have responsibility to the process of life, it's your animal programming overriding all logic and rationality with stupid rhetoric like entropy vs complexity and other such mindless crap.
Re:Alaska’s thawing soils are now pouring carbon dioxide int... by gooseus on Tuesday August 29, 2017 @05:31PM (#15127767)
Meh, obviously you're not the "we" I'm referring to... We appreciate your dedication to not propagating yourself, enjoy the rest of your time.
Re:Alaska’s thawing soils are now pouring carbon dioxide int... by colordrops on Wednesday August 23, 2017 @06:45PM (#15085852)
> I can only assume they spend most of the time face-palming, head-shaking and eye-rolling

Or they see us as a natural phenomenon following similar patterns to other fledgling civilizations. We don't roll our eyes when a pathogen is so virulent it kills its host before it propagates.

Re:Alaska’s thawing soils are now pouring carbon dioxide int... by Florin_Andrei on Wednesday August 23, 2017 @07:28PM (#15086142)
> we're on the very lowest bottom level of the sentience hierarchy

I don't have proof of this, but I think most creatures have some amount of awareness, progressively decreasing as you descend the great chain of central nervous system complexity. Probably decreasing quickly at first, from humans to primates to regular mammals, and more slowly afterwards, until asymptotically vanishing into virtual nothingness as there's no complex nervous system to speak of anymore.

Perhaps we're at the bottom of the interval of what could be called truly self-aware consciousness, as opposed to, I don't know, maybe somnolent or lethargic or dimly awake consciousness. With that I would agree.

Which of course automatically raises the question: why should the ascending arc stop here? And what do the next levels look like? Probably impossible for us to imagine even in principle, but still.