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Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by coldpie on Friday April 28, 2017 @08:24AM (#14218808)
I would love this, but can you imagine the gnashing of teeth from the 63 million people who voted for Trump? Not gonna happen. We're stuck with the for-profit Internet thanks to the scary, shouty man on TV.
Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by masondixon on Friday April 28, 2017 @10:05AM (#14219443)
You think the internet would be just as efficiently run if the government controlled it without a profit incentive?

I think the left are naive to how lazy people are without the right incentives, and how without a monetary incentive office politics can be ridiculously crippling.

Maybe the HN perspective is driven by the fact that open-source in software engineering has flourished - leading many to think that great things can be built without monetary incentive.

Or perhaps its because they are surrounded by very smart people and start believing that the rest of society operates at the same calibre.

There is enough politics involved inside companies where huge monetary incentives are up for grabs, when you take away this monetary incentive, it becomes insanely political.

Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by coldpie on Friday April 28, 2017 @11:54AM (#14220446)
Water and streets are doing relatively well. Any problems lately have occurred after Republicans cut infrastructure spending.
Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by metalliqaz on Friday April 28, 2017 @08:41AM (#14218900)
Honestly I don't care what those people think. Their judgement is bad and they should feel bad.
Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by rtx on Friday April 28, 2017 @08:45AM (#14218921)
People should feel bad for using CDNs.
Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by sleepychu on Friday April 28, 2017 @09:02AM (#14219004)
Can you expand? I don't understand this viewpoint.
Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by rtx on Friday April 28, 2017 @09:12AM (#14219062)
Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by masondixon on Friday April 28, 2017 @09:36AM (#14219218)
I think liberals' judgement is bad. They thought they would win the election and did not.
Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by muninn_ on Friday April 28, 2017 @08:51AM (#14218946)
"voting for trump" != voting for ISP monopolies and anti-net neutrality. Don't blame everything in the world on people who voted for Trump. Look at how difficult it was to get any sort of good regulation for net neutrality under Obama. You need to go after ISPs, Comcast, etc... and the people both R and D who get money from them.
Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by belltaco on Friday April 28, 2017 @09:16AM (#14219089)
Many of those people have actually been led believe it has something to do with quashing conservative media.

From the man himself:

Donald J. Trump‏ Verified account @realDonaldTrump

Obama’s attack on the internet is another top down power grab. Net neutrality is the Fairness Doctrine. Will target conservative media.

https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/status/53260835850816716...

Like those millions of people who believed the fake news fed to them, these people don't even know what it means, much less make an informed decision, so the Republicans aren't going to lose many votes over this compared to informed voters who are typically in the cities and vote D anyway.

Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by cat199 on Friday April 28, 2017 @11:20AM (#14220083)
> Like those millions of people who believed the fake news fed to them, these people don't even know what it means, much less make an informed decision, so the Republicans aren't going to lose many votes over this compared to informed voters who are typically in the cities and vote D anyway.

Totally, I mean, Obama's FCC and internet policy was completely on point, the unceasing vigilance to protect encryption and the snowden and wikileaks affairs really showed us that under his administration internet freedom and protection from dragnet surveillance was absolutely a top priority. The massive focus on these issues both in his campaign after bush as well as the continuation of making these issues a top priority in the Sanders and Hillary camps during the last cycle only proves this point even more, and I can only credit the well informed and highly vocal supporters of each candidate for making this the case.

Glad you made this point, I was thinking the same thing but too intimidated by the sheer number of the overwhelming majority of pro-trump neo-facists on this site!

Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by grzm on Friday April 28, 2017 @02:47PM (#14222004)
> the sheer number of the overwhelming majority of pro-trump neo-facists on this site!

Do you have any data to back this up? Please don't make sweeping generalizations of the HN membership. There's a wide variety of views held across the people who participate here, and due to each of our own very natural human psychological biases, we tend to view these in a very biased way. In my experience here, and as evidenced by the vigorous debate on any number of topics, it's decidedly unfair to characterize the membership in any sweeping way like this, and it also prevents people from being able to engage in meaningful, constructive conversation.

Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by cat199 on Friday April 28, 2017 @04:14PM (#14222705)
... thinking you missed the sarcasm here ...
Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by grzm on Friday April 28, 2017 @05:18PM (#14223130)
You're correct. I did miss the sarcasm.

Given that you've written so much sarcastically, what are you actual thoughts on the political demographics on HN? Often sarcasm is used to express the opposite of the actual belief, so is your belief that there is a wide variety of views, or is it that it's a majority of the opposite of "pro-Trump neo-fascist"? If the latter, my first comment still applies.

Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by muninn_ on Friday April 28, 2017 @10:21AM (#14219565)
Politicians will be politicians.

"Like those millions of people who believed the fake news fed to them,"

So people using Facebook which includes both Democrats and Republicans? You do realize a lot of Democrats are not technologists right? And that they won't have a better understanding of technology than their conservative brethren?

I know it's popular among my circle to just outright shit on all Republicans no matter what, but it's really not helping our cause.

Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by dragonwriter on Friday April 28, 2017 @10:22AM (#14219571)
> You do realize a lot of Democrats are not technologists right?

Technologists believe fake news, too.

Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by coldpie on Friday April 28, 2017 @08:56AM (#14218973)
Don't try to "both sides are the same" this. Look at the accomplishments of the previous administration's FCC and the current one. There is a stark difference.
Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by muninn_ on Friday April 28, 2017 @10:17AM (#14219540)
I didn't say "both sides are the same" even though they largely are. But you're naive if you think that Comcast isn't lobbying their democratize representatives in Philly to vote against net neutrality regulations.

Furthermore, look at how much work it took to get net neutrality passed even under Obama. If the democrats are so much on our side, why was it so difficult?

Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by coldpie on Friday April 28, 2017 @10:24AM (#14219583)
Under the Democrats, the FCC passed net neutrality, twice, after a court order struck down the first attempt. Under the Republicans, the FCC isn't just doing nothing, it's actively going out of its way to repeal it. The difference could not be more stark. If a neutral Internet is important to you, the sides are not even remotely the same.
Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by muninn_ on Friday April 28, 2017 @10:41AM (#14219723)
Right. My point is look how difficult it was. We (dems) dragged our feet doing it. Why?

I'm not defending the republican's choices here, I don't agree with what they're doing.

Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by simonh on Friday April 28, 2017 @11:27AM (#14220153)
Is the internet not for-profit right now? Comcast doesn't seem to be struggling. ISPs are highly profitable as it is.
Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by TallGuyShort on Friday April 28, 2017 @09:23AM (#14219129)
Yeah I miss Obama. Remember last year when the Internet wasn't run by private companies? And when the people who voted for Trump weren't Republicans yet? Suddenly on January 20th all these things that happened before were suddenly his fault.
Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by unityByFreedom on Friday April 28, 2017 @09:39AM (#14219241)
Uhhh Obama's FCC didn't push to remove net neutrality after pushback from the public.

With a new administration, content providers are looking amp up lobbying and give it another go.

We need to forget politics red vs. blue and consider that this may be a bad idea. If we make it an unpopular position for politicians to support, they won't pass it.

Votes beat dollars because at the end of the day, without your vote, politicians supporting a given position don't have the job.

Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by TallGuyShort on Friday April 28, 2017 @10:18AM (#14219548)
>> We need to forget politics red vs. blue and consider that this may be a bad idea. If we make it an unpopular position for politicians to support, they won't pass it.

Then let's stop blaming the shouting man for stuff other than being the idiot he is. There's plenty of other folks to blame, and plenty of them were in power before now. There was plenty of scary and stupid Internet regulation discussed under Obama that he didn't react to the way I would have liked AT ALL. There's plenty of stuff Democrats suddenly decided they didn't like and Republicans suddenly decided they like when in reality it's hardly that different at all. There's a bunch of shitty people in Congress and in many other sectors of government, and let's not forget that they're not going to go away once anyone's President-of-choice wins the next election, or that they're not partly responsible for a whole bunch of conservatives feeling disenfranchised and going with a lunatic as an overreaction.

Re:More than 800 startups sign letter objecting to plans to ... by unityByFreedom on Friday April 28, 2017 @10:40AM (#14219709)
> Then let's stop blaming the shouting man for stuff other than being the idiot he is

I can't control what other people say =)

> There was plenty of scary and stupid Internet regulation discussed under Obama that he didn't react to the way I would have liked AT ALL

I agree. For example, he was totally wrong about how to deal with everyone having access to E2E encryption in their pockets.

All I can do is advocate for focusing on this one issue. I believe in net neutrality and I think if more people understand how it contributed to today's internet, then more would be on board.

One thing to note is that net neutrality was always built into ISPs until content providers started focusing on subscriptions to data via the internet rather than TV.

At that point, content companies started to see how they could corner markets by using dollars to persuade ISPs to give them better throughput than smaller competition.

So, while the neutrality regulation only came into place in 2015, it was really standard practice up until then.

> There's a bunch of shitty people in Congress and in many other sectors of government, and let's not forget that they're not going to go away once anyone's President-of-choice wins the next election, or that they're not partly responsible for a whole bunch of conservatives feeling disenfranchised and going with a lunatic as an overreaction.

Yes, well, I think in this case we can set aside how inept many in government seem to be. On this issue, I think we can come together and agree that net neutrality is a good thing, and that Netflix or Comcast shouldn't be able to give you faster speeds to certain websites, because that means you'll be paying more to visit sites that they don't own, thus limiting your choices.