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Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by saycheese on Monday March 20, 2017 @09:11AM (#13913826)
AR will become mainstream at the point people see it as the norm in public.

Apple's core advantage is that they set the standard for mobile smart devices and consumer will follow them if they're able to gain momentum.

Question at that point swings back to how they'll try to do it, which becomes highly speculative.

If I had to guess, they'll morph the iPhone to a AR device like the morphed the iPod to a phone; meaning the first step is to add AR to the iPhone and gain traction.

Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by shadowmint on Monday March 20, 2017 @09:22AM (#13913920)
> they'll morph the iPhone to a AR device

...eventually, maybe; probably after someone else has first.

The technology backing this is the stuff that the kinect was based on, by PrimeSense; it's for 3d spatial scanning, and it's super cool tech, but it's no more 'AR' than the kinect was or the leap motion was; turns out that even if you have a point cloud, AR is still hard.

The sad thing is that there's no sign that Apple is actually building any kind of meaningful product with it.

Any kind of competitive advantage Apple might have as a company hinges on them actually building something novel and meaningful in this space.

I know they like to be all ninja and secret with their R&D, but you can't just hide in a closet for 6 months with a million dollars and pull out a strong AI; that sort of technological leap just doesn't happen very much any more, and certainly not without a lot of people noticing the massive amount of money it consumes to produce.

Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by saycheese on Monday March 20, 2017 @09:33AM (#13914017)
Being first is irrelevant when it comes to being mainstream. Apple's iPod was not the first mobile digital music player, nor was the iPhone the first smartphone.

Being novel also isn't that important. For example, Apple's white earphones played a major role in getting the public to see that their devices were mainstream, but there was nothing truly novel about them.

Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by ethbro on Monday March 20, 2017 @09:54AM (#13914206)
Being first may be irrelevant, but if you're never first then someone else has to come up with the tech first.

I believe parent comments are mostly making the point that we still have another generation before Apple would have anything sufficiently advanced enough that they could do their post-90s "polish and package" magic.

Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by saycheese on Monday March 20, 2017 @10:07AM (#13914315)
"Polish" is irrelevant as it relates to realism - what matters is people believe it adds value realitive to the cost to them, which includes the social impact it has on them.
Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by hyperpallium on Monday March 20, 2017 @09:51AM (#13914177)
You're right in general, but iPhone was the first touchscreen smartphone. Today, (almost) all smartphones look like an iPhone. (Though Apple didn't invent the touchscreen.)
Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by MagnumOpus on Monday March 20, 2017 @11:41AM (#13915101)
Beyond what the others are saying about IBM's Simon, Apple wasn't even the first with a capacitive touchscreen - they did it a year after the LG Prada...
Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by ethbro on Monday March 20, 2017 @10:02AM (#13914282)
Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by saycheese on Monday March 20, 2017 @10:02AM (#13914279)
IBM Simon was the first phone with a touchscreen in 1992.
Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by Cthulhu_ on Monday March 20, 2017 @09:37AM (#13914057)
The iPhone already is an AR device though, and one of its first major apps was an AR application - Layar, back in 2009. One of its major apps has an AR component (Pokemon Go).

I could see them making a Google Cardboard-like mounting bracket / dock for the iphone I guess, maybe with better cameras and sensors.

Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by mulletbum on Monday March 20, 2017 @09:48AM (#13914159)
I think Google Glass is more where they will go. Except, just like the first iPhone, they will make it actually look like a normal pair of sunglasses. Apple has NEVER made new products, but they have refined existing products at key times to come out with something amazing. iPod, iPad, iPhone were not the first, but they were breakthrough staples that rules their area. Apple Glasses would do the same if done right.
Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by root_axis on Monday March 20, 2017 @10:10AM (#13914338)
> Except, just like the first iPhone, they will make it actually look like a normal pair of sunglasses.

Not going to happen (any time soon). That's an insurmountable engineering challenge for the foreseeable future.

Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by MarkMc on Monday March 20, 2017 @10:40AM (#13914576)
Let's get specific: How long do you think it will be before Apple release iGlasses? 10 years?
Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by root_axis on Monday March 20, 2017 @10:51AM (#13914673)
I'm not sure when they will release a product in the vein of "iGlasses", but I'm certain they won't release an AR device that "looks like a normal pair of sunglasses" within 10 years. This isn't a situation where incremental progress will make this possible, there would need to be a fundamental breakthrough in battery and GPU efficiency that, while possible, is not necessary inevitable and definitely not on track within a predictable timeline.
Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by probablybanned on Monday March 20, 2017 @01:55PM (#13916216)
What do you think about solving this with wireless power transfer? There has been some promising research recently into extending the range of resonant inductive coupling.

It's nobody's ideal, but a clip-on/necklace style power solution might be sellable to the public if the value proposition of the glasses is good enough.

Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by root_axis on Monday March 20, 2017 @02:30PM (#13916485)
A future where resonance charging equipment is safe, functionally practical and ubiquitous is sort of a breakthrough scenario in and of itself, but even then, you're still talking about a technology that is somewhat out of reach. Even if we can squeeze the necessary GPU power into the form factor of "a normal pair of sunglasses", consider the additional heat dissipation requirements of a device as thin as normal glasses that is also in a state of perpetual charge, especially when we take into account the human face's particular sensitivity to heat.

Maybe very thick oversized (by today's standards) frames will come into style and something like that will be on the border of possibility, but it seems like a real stretch within the next 10 years.

Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by probablybanned on Monday March 20, 2017 @06:36PM (#13918248)
After thinking it over a bit, I'm going to take the other side of the bet.

We agree that power consumption is a limiting factor no matter what. In my imagined system, only something on the order of 1W would be delivered to the glasses. Delivering 1W over 10cm with large-ish coil area at >50% efficiency using NFMR isn't really a breakthrough, but it's only a way of eliminating the LiPo bulk and nothing more.

The thing is, I don't think we're near the boundary of power efficiency even with today's silicon. The way forward is to push all the feature tracking and other low-level vision tasks down to the ASIC level, while accepting some strict limitations on the rendering side. So a lot of it comes down to scope of features. Its most immediately useful applications are little more than a glorified HUD -- project some GPS data here or an info overlay there. Blit a video source on top of a marker, that sort of thing.

This sort of practical product, by 2027, I'll say yes. Mindblowing, transform-your-world stuff? No. But let's see what happens...

Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by saycheese on Monday March 20, 2017 @09:45AM (#13914119)
Speculation is rising that Apple will add 3D sensing to give the phone a sense of depth to be used for augmented reality applications.

3D sensing is not a new technology and was initially adopted by Microsoft‘s Kinect and Lenovo‘s Tango-enabled Phab2 Pro.

Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by pmontra on Monday March 20, 2017 @09:49AM (#13914161)
AR will become mainstream, yes. Apple will do well in AR, maybe but future is difficult to forecast.

Anyway, my prescription glasses are maybe 25 grams (0.89 ounces). I think the current technology is a long way from giving us something as light as that even if the bulk of it rests in our pocket. I expect to read about the upcoming AR revolution for many years.

Re:Apple is betting on augmented reality by saycheese on Monday March 20, 2017 @10:00AM (#13914258)
AR is not only about eyes, nor does it require realistic overlay - all that's required is it's sync'd to reality and augments reality.