News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:I made my son cannabis cookies. They changed his life by edblarney on Sunday January 08, 2017 @11:50AM (#13350569)
"The war on drugs is probably one of the biggest crime against humanity since WW2 "

Spoken by someone who has never known an opioid or cocaine addict, and watched lives crumble, sometimes into death.

Most drugs are quite dangerous and have seriously adverse affects upon populations at large.

Cocaine, Meth, and Opioids create massive social health problems far beyond anything dope or alcohol ever could.

I have no doubt there are 'responsible' users out there, but in general, those things will lay waste to populations at large.

I had a friend who lived in his (wealthy) parents basement, smocking crack all day, every day. Visiting with him - there was gerbil feces everywhere, a divot in the sofa were he sat all day, and a pile of ashes next to him on the sofa. He had every opportunity in life, he now lives in a clinic.

Another 'responsible partier' friend in who died of suffocation 'laughing gas' mask to his face.

Another - a weed addict (yes, despite the fact that pot is not really chemically addictive, there is definitely such a thing as addiction) - who threw himself in front of a subway in despair. Not blaming the drugs, but it's specifically related in this case.

A family member who is point-blank prescription opioid addict - and it's complicated because she gets debilitating migraines that few drugs can help her with, but the 'solution' is poison.

And finally - close family members and friends who are 'chronic' pot smokers, who manage it quite well, but are basically always high. It has dramatically affected their lives, though they are functional - they are entirely different people. I'm not sure if I would call that addiction, but I would say it is problematic.

I live in a mixed neighbourhood of creatives/wealthy/working class, there's a health clinic across the street - and the effect of crack in my neighbourhood is quite visible.

Visit places where the 'war on drugs' is truly being lost, like West Virginia, and you get the picture pretty quickly.

Of course there is no reason to put pot smokers in jail - but this antagonism about the 'war on drugs' is very naive, unsympathetic, and dangerous.

Chewing on coca leaves? Maybe. The occasional LSD/Hyabithsca user? Doesn't matter.

But there is no way we will legalize opioids, coke, meth - it doesn't matter that some can 'handle it' - it just wreaks havoc overall. On the whole they destroy lives, families, social scenes, and this is before the legal framework.

I think that the 'perception' problem of the 'war on drugs' is largely led by people who are recreational users, living in the 'Burning Man' bubble of people who have their act together. Then they read up on 'jailing' because of this and that. Remember that if you're in that club, heck, if you're reading HN, you're probably in the top 5% of Americans, and probably the top 0.1% of global population.

Visit your local Salvation Army :)

Re:I made my son cannabis cookies. They changed his life by ovibos on Sunday January 08, 2017 @12:24PM (#13350781)
You're sort of attacking a straw man here - just because someone is against the war on drugs doesn't mean they are for indiscriminate legalization. The biggest criticisms of the war on drugs in this thread are that it A) attacks people who are no threat to anyone else or themselves (e.g., cannibas and psychedelic users, "responsible" users in general) because of public misconceptions of these drugs pushed by the powers that be, and that B) it attacks people who are very much in need of help, such as addicts of more dangerous/addictive drugs, by punishing them for what is effectively a disease.

Opinions of HN users may vary on how exactly to fix these problems, but I think it's safe to say that neither the system we have now (villainizing and condemning users) nor complete and total deregulation are solutions.

Re:I made my son cannabis cookies. They changed his life by baddox on Sunday January 08, 2017 @11:59AM (#13350615)
> Of course there is no reason to put pot smokers in jail - but this antagonism about the 'war on drugs' is very naive, unsympathetic, and dangerous.

The part of this sentence after the hyphen is where you're fundamentally wrong. You listed a lot of sad facts and stories about drug abuse, but those do not constitute a defense of the war on drugs. It's naive to excuse the war on drugs simply because some drugs cause horrible effects for some people.

Re:I made my son cannabis cookies. They changed his life by edblarney on Sunday January 08, 2017 @12:05PM (#13350657)
"some drugs cause horrible effects for some people."

No.

Meth, cocaine and opioids represent the vast majority of illegal use outside of weed (which I think is a different category, and it is treated differently in most places) - and they represent a huge risk to society at large.

Prescription opioid use is becoming a massive problem (and now the #1 source of addiction etc.) in the US - it's systematic - not just a problem for 'some people'.

This not about 'specific examples' - it's widespread and systematic.

Re:I made my son cannabis cookies. They changed his life by bigmanwalter on Sunday January 08, 2017 @01:46PM (#13351217)
So rather then funding jails and law enforcement, there should be more money going toward rehabilitation programs.

Making drugs illegal ultimately prevents people from getting the help they need.

Re:I made my son cannabis cookies. They changed his life by baddox on Sunday January 08, 2017 @02:27PM (#13351428)
Sorry, what is your dispute with my claim? That is indeed some drugs causing horrible effects for some people.
Re:I made my son cannabis cookies. They changed his life by deepnotderp on Sunday January 08, 2017 @12:02PM (#13350643)
1) And jailing addicts is supposed to help?

2) the infinitely more dangerous threat,which you accurately described, is opioids...yet ask an average high schooler and they'll tell you they were taught weed is so evil...

3) oh, and lack of health insurance kills more people in the US than cocaine

Re:I made my son cannabis cookies. They changed his life by edblarney on Sunday January 08, 2017 @12:08PM (#13350683)
1) 'Jail' - I never said they should jail them. But they should jail the dealers, yes. Moreover, 'required rehab' would be beneficial.

In Canada (a prison in Ottawa, specifically) if you 'go in' an opioid addict, the actually give you 3 doses of methodone a day. A friend of mine in there for a few days (small thing) described them as insane zombies, banging on the door to the clinic when it was almost time for their next dose.

The 'short term' harm reduction ideal of 'giving them drugs' might be nice, but in the 'long term' - keeping people jacked on opioids for months at a time has to be one of the most cruel things imaginable.

2) I think that most 'high schoolers' grasp that heroin, meth and coke are far worse than weed.

3) This is a separate issue. In other countries, such as Canada, we still have 'the war on drugs' - and 'free healthcare'.

Re:I made my son cannabis cookies. They changed his life by artpepper on Sunday January 08, 2017 @01:55PM (#13351266)
(3) isn't a completely separate issue. Incarceration sucks up a lot of public funds that could go toward treatment programs.
Re:I made my son cannabis cookies. They changed his life by jimnotgym on Sunday January 08, 2017 @12:17PM (#13350738)
>A family member who is point-blank prescription opioid addict - and it's complicated because she gets debilitating migraines that few drugs can help her with, but the 'solution' is poison.

Paracetamol (is this tylenol in the US) is a pretty effective poison too. Many drugs are poisonous either in large doses or sustained use. It appears cannabis is not one of them btw. What is your solution?

Re:I made my son cannabis cookies. They changed his life by throwanem on Sunday January 08, 2017 @12:55PM (#13350943)
We call it acetaminophen; Tylenol is the primary brand name under which it's sold.

I don't think GP advances a blanket solution, which is good, because there isn't one. I do think he's a bit arguing against a blanket legalization policy that no one here is advancing, and that's good too, because that way lies madness.