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Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by kutkloon7 on Sunday December 18, 2016 @11:22AM (#13206301)
The arrest and torture of an exorbitant number of 'enemies of the state', including judges, police officers, and teachers, indicates more important problems in Turkey.

For some reason, a lot of Turks still seem to support Erdogan. The West doesn't really care what he does, as long as Turkey takes care of most of the refugees.

A disgusting European policy.

Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by sctb on Sunday December 18, 2016 @01:24PM (#13206873)
Please resist the temptation to scoot right back up to generic politics in a thread like this. We've had that discussion before on Hacker News, let's try to have a new one.
Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by kutkloon7 on Monday December 19, 2016 @07:53AM (#13211088)
Even though there is some technical information in it, the message of the article is purely political and I don't see how one can discuss this article without going into politics.
Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by chris_wot on Thursday December 22, 2016 @07:49AM (#13236907)
I have to agree. This entire article is about the action of the Erogan government when they decided to block Tor, so it's a bit rich for someone to scold you over making an on-point, if perhaps controversial, comment.

How's that week of no politics working out for HN?

Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by tyingq on Sunday December 18, 2016 @11:42AM (#13206388)
>For some reason, a lot of Turks still seem to support Erdogan

You hear 3 reasons, typically...

- Viewed as a champion for lower class citizens, who weren't well represented in past administrations

- Supportive of religious conservatives, also not represented well in the past

- The economy has improved under his tenure. Inflation slowed, infrastructure improved, etc.

Not disputing your view of him, but he is popular for palpable reasons.

Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by grenoire on Sunday December 18, 2016 @01:37PM (#13206928)
Internal economy seems like it has improved by the numbers, but the greatest problem is the longevity of these improvements. If Turkey is not able to keep its economy together, whereas it will likely not be able to due to the aforementioned improvements being a result of the construction industry supplying for no demand, it is going to crash very badly.

Additionally, with its foreign policies and own political and socioeconomic problems, foreign investment has gone down significantly, leading to a great exchange rate declines (1.2 USD/TRY prior to the 2008 crisis, to 3.5 USD/TRY close today).

Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by agumonkey on Sunday December 18, 2016 @11:46AM (#13206407)
I still remember the people kicking tanks away the night of the failed coup. That dude has fans.
Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by diego_moita on Sunday December 18, 2016 @01:01PM (#13206772)
> A disgusting European policy.

I suggest you understand it before you criticize it. It is called Westphalian Sovereignity[0] and Europeans have very solid and good reasons for it.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Westphalian_sovereignty

Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by kutkloon7 on Monday December 19, 2016 @08:09AM (#13211115)
I meant the EU (initially) wanting to accept them on the sole premise of 'taking care' of refugees. Anybody in it's right mind wouldn't want to have anything to do with Turkey in it's current state.
Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by myf01d on Sunday December 18, 2016 @12:38PM (#13206647)
Because there is now a sufficient majority of Turks who want to destroy the secular Turkey, apply gradually more and more islamic country and get rid of Turkey's within enemies: Secular people and Kurds. Erdogan is just listening to the people like he says, he only additionally wants to destroy and humiliate his personal and political enemies because he is a psycho. Furthermore, he adores money, his family built an multi-billion empire during his reign.
Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by shsyqbaw on Sunday December 18, 2016 @12:49PM (#13206715)
That's a good question: if there's a majority of Turks who support the regime, what's the problem? Can't we like, leave them in peace? Do we have to impose western politics everywhere in the world??
Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by Zenst on Sunday December 18, 2016 @01:04PM (#13206787)
Real crux comes how the EU is bending over backwards to borg them and yet the majority of Europeans do not care for the state of Turkey and its actions, let alone absorbing them into the EU.

This and people confuse western politics with humanity and moral standards and that is an area in which Turkey is nose-diving at an alarming rate. Very concerning indeed :(.

Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by myf01d on Sunday December 18, 2016 @12:56PM (#13206752)
The real question should be: Why does the US want to apply "democracy" and "human rights" using all means including interventions and civil wars like in Iraq, Syria and Libya but it acts as if there nothing happens for more criminal regimes like in Turkey, Saudi Arabia and Qatar?
Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by Zenst on Sunday December 18, 2016 @01:08PM (#13206810)
Indeed and does highlight a level of corruption in which money allows you to get away with murder, most literally in some Middle Eastern countries you mention. This and the EU's pokemon attitude to the European tectonic pklate of got too collect them all, seems to allow some serious issues to get dismissed and overlooked in Turkey alone.

As for Qatar and Saudi Arabia, again, if they were not rich countries would they be allowed as much slack as they do.

Still, maybe people had enough of this level of corruption and double-standards being allowed; Which may in part explain how people vote in today's times.

Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by ercu on Sunday December 18, 2016 @01:25PM (#13206877)
Actually most of the Turkish people think that US has tried to coup in Turkey with the help of CIA and very religious and anti-secular (who hates Ataturk) Gulen group. That group is so dangerous that they even faked themselves as secular on coup text which was read on tv forcedly.

That religious group has been ruling the country with their own politicians, lawyers, soldiers for the last 40 years however they want. Erdogan helped them gain power against real secular people and even jailed secular soldiers and journalists with this partnership. Many good people died in jail because of getting cancer.

Currently he is in a war against his old friend Gulen and clearing Turkey up from them. Both secular people and his fans support this action as that group ruined the country.

However Erdogan is upset at EU and US because they left him alone with his war so that's why he tries to provocate EU. Don't give a meaning to his sayings/actions.

Btw Kurds and PKK (terrorists) are very different. Don't get fooled by western media.

Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by enraged_camel on Sunday December 18, 2016 @01:20PM (#13206854)
With Saudi Arabia and Qatar, the answer is obvious: because those countries invest boatloads of money in the American economy, and losing that money would be bad.

Turkey is a NATO ally and has a very powerful and experienced military as well as a strong sense of national identity. The USA could not openly intervene like it did with Iraq, Syria and Libya.

Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by enraged_camel on Sunday December 18, 2016 @01:15PM (#13206833)
>>if there's a majority of Turks who support the regime, what's the problem?

There are at least two problems.

First, the "will of the people" argument works only if there is a strong culture of democracy, respect for the rule of law and proper representation of minorities. None of those things exist in Turkey (I'm Turkish). Typically, what happens when Erdogan wins elections is that he views it as a "mandate" and starts oppressing the shit out of his opposition by jailing or exiling people who disagree with him. He has gone so far as to use his party to change laws in his favor. And all those infrastructure improvements he has made? They have all enriched himself and his buddies (called "crony capitalism").

Second, Turkey is an extremely important player in the Middle East. If we want the region to stop spiraling out of control, there needs to be a modern, stable and secular democracy with a Muslim population there that can be used as a model by other countries. Otherwise the region will always be in turmoil, which will inevitably spill over to Europe and the rest of the world (in the form of refugees, extremist terrorists, etc.).

Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by kutkloon7 on Monday December 19, 2016 @08:16AM (#13211160)
If you don't vote for Erdogan, you have a serious problem. I don't like Hitler comparisons, and I don't want to say that Erdogan is comparable to Hitler, but it's a bit like saying 'If Hitler was elected democratically, what's the problem?'.
Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by coldtea on Sunday December 18, 2016 @12:30PM (#13206609)
>For some reason, a lot of Turks still seem to support Erdogan. The West doesn't really care what he does, as long as Turkey takes care of most of the refugees. A disgusting European policy.

That's probably for the best. In the areas that there were leaders that West did care about (or pretended to, for control and resources) and actively intervened, they created hell holes of civil war, chaos and fundamentalism.

Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by icebraining on Sunday December 18, 2016 @11:46AM (#13206404)
What do you think Europe should do?
Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by kutkloon7 on Monday December 19, 2016 @08:19AM (#13211177)
Cancel (instead of 'freezing') the negotiations about Turkey entering the EU, cancel the refugee agreement , and set repercussions for the torture, control of media, use of intimidation for votes for Erdogan, the blackmail of the EU (and countless other things, but you get the picture).
Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by petre on Sunday December 18, 2016 @12:45PM (#13206688)
Erdogan has reignited PKK terrorism.
Re:Tor blocked in Turkey as government cracks down on VPN use by agumonkey on Sunday December 18, 2016 @11:44AM (#13206398)
Sorry for the digression, in democracy, if 49% of the voters are non violent enemies is it a problem ?