Choke Point of a Nation: The High Cost of an Aging River Lock

Re:Choke Point of a Nation: The High Cost of an Aging River ... by gwern on Sunday November 27, 2016 @07:43PM (#13052622)

"Meanwhile, the old locks and dams are costing the country $640 million a year in delays and closures, according to the Army corps....Even with a tax credit, though, companies building roads or locks would want a return on their investment — most likely in the form of toll collection, said Mike Toohey, president of the Waterways Council, an advocacy group for the river shipping industry. His industry is “not in favor of a toll,” he said. Still, he is optimistic that spending on inland waterways will increase under a new administration."

What baffles me is the total dismissal of a private infratructure project which charges tolls. This would seem to be a perfect project for user-pays funding: the project offers a service with a specific, discrete in time and place, easily calculated value which is extremely large to the user who are supposedly suffering severely under the status quo. My only guess is that the lobbyist affiliation here is the whole story: the industries think they can get full taxpayer subsidies for the costs without having to pay much or any of it, and it's worth waiting for a government solution.

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Re:Choke Point of a Nation: The High Cost of an Aging River ... by sandworm101 on Sunday November 27, 2016 @07:56PM (#13052681)

Anyone and everyone gets nervous when people talk about tolls on infrastructure bottlenecks. This isn't a car bridge. There is no alternative route, at any price. Those using the lock would have no option but to pay. Such a monopoly in private hands will never be popular.

Tolls on interstate infrastructure have also traditionally been looked down upon. Charging people to move themselves or goods across state lines, even where arguably constitutional, rubs Americans the wrong way. Easing interstate commerce is a large part of why the federal government exists.

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Re:Choke Point of a Nation: The High Cost of an Aging River ... by caf on Sunday November 27, 2016 @07:51PM (#13052654)

I suspect that if there are multiple river shipping companies but one monopoly lock operator, all of the economic surplus in the river transport industry will be captured by that monopoly operator.

Perhaps the solution is for the river shipping industry to form a co-op to build, own and operate the necessary infrastructure.

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Re:Choke Point of a Nation: The High Cost of an Aging River ... by honkhonkpants on Sunday November 27, 2016 @07:52PM (#13052665)

Good idea! The more people we get to buy into the cooperative the better it will be! If we get everybody to participate we can just call it "government".

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Re:Choke Point of a Nation: The High Cost of an Aging River ... by pc2g4d on Monday November 28, 2016 @06:33PM (#13059351)

Except that government is universal, whereas a river cooperative would only affect the parties directly involved. Thus you could scale things up without getting to government-scale.

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Re:Choke Point of a Nation: The High Cost of an Aging River ... by mjevans on Monday November 28, 2016 @03:27AM (#13054149)

People would complain less if the costs involved were clearly spelled out, as well as who was paying the costs.

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Re:Choke Point of a Nation: The High Cost of an Aging River ... by NegativeLatency on Sunday November 27, 2016 @09:26PM (#13052992)

You should read Cadillac Dessert. Lots of water projects aren't profitable on their own (generally irrigation projects) and rely on hydroelectric revenues to appear financially viable.

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Re:Choke Point of a Nation: The High Cost of an Aging River ... by Theodores on Monday November 28, 2016 @02:19AM (#13053946)

This book probably is the best for understanding how this infrastructure was built in the first place. Isn't ever river dammed west of the Mississippi? That was a crazy amount of work that two rival govt. agencies did very much in competition until they ran out of rivers to build dams for.

So it is no surprise that this infrastructure - built in very different political circumstances to today - is not going to be maintained. When you look at all of it - infrastructure, America - none of it is going to be maintained when the oil runs out. Suburbia with those nice big highways wasn't ever going to be viable post oil. Hopefully Tesla can make U.S. suburbia viable.

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