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Re:Code I’m Still Ashamed Of by croon on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @09:07AM (#12966883)
Completely agree. While I like the idea that we all share some responsibility about the decisions we make, and I applaud you for yours, it shouldn't be on the implementor to fix. The companies/heads demanding this should be the ones liable, and heavily so.

To make a crude and polarizing comparison, especially since I happen to land somewhat on the other side of that argument:

You can't blame a tool (bat/knife/gun) for what its agent does with it. If one tool doesn't work for them, they'll get it done with something else.

Re:Code I’m Still Ashamed Of by JoeAltmaier on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @09:22AM (#12966974)
Sadly I suspect corporate decisions get made in a microcosm. Whatever is good for the next quarter or next product. A middle manager would be fired for doing anything else. Or at least reviewed badly. "Sure you did the right thing; but your numbers were down. Sorry no raise/promotion"

So there is no particular person in a corporation that has direct incentive to be responsible.

Re:Code I’m Still Ashamed Of by st3v3r on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @02:24PM (#12970486)
So we need to change that. We need to make sure there is a heavy stick being used against those that decide to make these unethical decisions.
Re:Code I’m Still Ashamed Of by jarcane on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @09:20AM (#12966967)
After all, I was just following orders ...
Re:Code I’m Still Ashamed Of by croon on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @09:47AM (#12967243)
Yes, I understand that this is the logical followup, but there were individuals standing up to orders and being executed, and it didn't make a lick of difference when the problem was systemic.

As I opened with, yes, to some extent we all share the blame, but appealing to everyone to individually make the difference will never work, because it only takes a few to still get the (dirty) job done. If everyone played nice we wouldn't need any laws.

Re:Code I’m Still Ashamed Of by JoeAltmaier on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @09:50AM (#12967289)
Still, if there's nobody at the 'top' making decisions (and unless the CEO micromanages there isn't) then we've just moved the problem from Engineers to Middle Managers.

Somebody has to take a stand. In Canada they have an Engineering oath and code of ethics. We should all aspire to be our better selves. After all, we're not being executed; we'll just have to find another contract.

Re:Code I’m Still Ashamed Of by croon on Wednesday November 16, 2016 @09:56AM (#12967388)
Sure, but I as an engineer can't control a middle manager, but a CEO most definitely can. If you make the CEO liable, he/she sure as hell will move the incentives towards better practices.

Ideally I absolutely agree with you, and we should all strive for the best and make a stand wherever possible, but the cynic in me believes that it can never completely solve the issues, just shift the burden to someone else down the line.